[REBOL] Re: What's native?
From: petr:krenzelok:trz:cz at: 24-Jun-2004 14:17
>>Then I saw Delphi apps. Man, what does Delphi do? It is like Visual
>>Basic. It support bad design from the very beginning. You can easily be
>>in the same league with rebol Starting with form is bad imo. E.g. CA-VO
>>started with MDI or SDI window as a top window, then menu and menu opens
>>other windows. While Delphi (well, last I saw was 5.x family) simply
>>starts with form. Ppl put buttons directly on form together with menu at
>Might be. And? What's the message here? Others are doing bad apps but
>those apps are used? Well, than there is something they are doing right.
>My point is: We don't need to dicuss if people are morons or not, if apps
>are bad or not. The fact is, we have to face this situation! And we need a
>solutions that works out. If we can't find one, ...
OK, this is what you wrote:
Hmmm... not a standard GUI? Than it's not a standard application and we
don't use it. Have a nice day.
The message here is simple - now I do look as a moron :-) You started
with claim that it was Rebol non standard compliant UI which is show
stopper. So why do you ask me here, how is that even other bad apps are
used? It is not fault of Rebol technology, nor of IOS as a product
itself. What does it have in common with RT being 3 ppl company? It
simply contradicts itself - so what is the REAL reason why they told
no-go for IOS? Excuse me, but what does have Borland size and track
record in common with app usability? You did not mention they may be
scared of tech support issues, consultancy available etc. - that is of
course very different issue and you know that I will be first who will
criticise current situation - RT, nearly non existant consultancy, OEM,
VAR networks, job offerings etc. all being a weak decision point here.
>>That is really piggy aproach which I would not tolerate in my
>>team (well, maybe i am crazy enough, I forbig my folks to use windows
>>registry - our apps are installed by "copy & run" principle - much
>How many have you meat with the same understanding? Yes, I agree. But it
>doesn't help, if we both knwe it and all others don't care. Than we have
>the problem, not the others.
Yes, we have the problem. I was a programmer - not a good one probably,
but I belonged to such groups, now mainly participating on some
projects, but in non-programmer way. I know that IT ppl suck. They all
have their tools of choice. It is the same with all of us - we want to
do everything using Rebol. You would have to see some inner fightings of
our Delphi, LN, SAP groups. To them Rebol or anything not currently
already used in their company is an alien which should be blown from the
planet earth by Ripley :-) So - IIRC this discussion started about
Rebol, its UI and the question if Rebol should mimick native UI or not.
I can bet that even with WinXP skin you would still have problem selling
IOS to such company. As Steve said - find some responsible managers and
never talk to IT ppl - they will refuse anything new, as they will think
they can do it using their already existant tools ....