World: r3wp

darn, I go away a few hours and Carl pops in.... basically offering 
what I've been dreaming for the last Decade!
  

I would really like to participate in the host code, right now, I'm 
basically giving myself a very in-depth course in applied 3D graphics 
and I won't lie in saying I'd rather do it R3 if I would be sure 
that I won't run into an unknown and be stuck.


my comment wrt R3 being buggy, is not a comment on the quality of 
R3 itself, but the fact that many core things still change quite 
often.  so code using R3, especially very hard to debug and complex 
code like 3d arithmetics can become a nightware with the slightest 
little change.

Just hang around online for the next 24 hours Max

Quicker to talk to Carl on r3 chat

true, I'll go there and see if there's more news for me.

Carl, I posted messages to you privately on R3 chat... in case you 
didn't see them.

From the sidelines, I hope this bears fruit Maxim (and Carl). Very 
cool.


One favour to ask.  Max, if you get hold of our low levels ... be 
gentle ... try and factor some of it down so the 2 dimensional 4 
digit brain types still have a chance to decode some of that whiz 
bang almost too far out of the box stuff I suspect you may have brewing. 
 :)

don't worry, I want stuff to be simple to USE... its the behind the 
scenes which is complex  ;-)

Carl: "Cyphre was in charge of all graphics. But, he vanished into 
the Qtask black hole a year ago." More precisely, you stopped updating 
the host code on CVS, and me and him stopped having the ability to 
do anything useful on that front in the little time we had available.

Carl: I have the same feedback from Cyphre - he was mainly waiting 
for the "Go" and synced sources ...

Carl: Couldn't  more agree with Gabriele here. If you update the 
Host codebase so it is possible to compile latest R3 builds...things 
can start move on again especially in the upcoming days.

Carl, listen to the chorus: Release some source, even if it is a 
limited release to the interested-and-qualified-helpers. You need 
help :(

I second BrianH's opinion - please release to the first limited group 
of Devs, to prevent possible initial chaos. As for me - I think that 
we CAN manage the situation, even if you would release it publicly. 
Not many ppl use R3 Chat do download sources nowadays. I think that 
if you set some coordinator or two, e.g. BrianH, Henrik, Maxim  - 
whoever who will accept the role, then we will be fine and even other 
ppl can study the code and try some things for themselves ...

Yes... I agree... it is my fault!

wow... carl and I here at the SAME time  ;-)

Hello Maxim. Wow.

every other time you've been here, I was off line for a one or two 
hour period... and everytime you're not here, I'm there during those 
hours... hehehe

BTW... I was looking at your timings... puzzled by FOR times, I ran 
it in A94:
>> dt [loop 800 [for i 1 1000 1 []]]
== 0:00:00.015

is it still a mezz in R3?

Pekr, so R3 Chat is difficult to get source code? You can't be serious.
>> 26
.../Mezzaines
>> get *
--- Note: wrote file: work/r3/mezzanines/mezz-banner.r
--- Note: wrote file: work/r3/mezzanines/mezz-control.r
--- Note: wrote file: work/r3/mezzanines/mezz-debug.r
...

Maxim: native.

ah... that's why  :-)

Anyhow... the blame for the Host is not on Cypre or anyone other 
than me.

BTW, I *always* tell new users... "do not use FOR" unless absolutely 
necessary.

you could just setup a simple svn for it... its really simple to 
setup, and we can all easily participate and share our stuff, even 
if working on the same files.

simple and svn cannot be used in the same sentence, if I recall correctly.

But the reason I use DevBase (R3 Chat) is because it has accept/deny 
recordkeeping.

cvs is hell, but svn is really simple, at least on windows it is.

for example, with tortoise, its integrated directly inside the file 
explorer  :-)

Well, anyway, that's not the blocking factor.

Yes, I have tortoise, but I don't use it much... because it's not 
that practical for work flow.

So, Maxim, what's your main Dev system, is it Win32?

So, here's a rough game plan...

yep.  I also have a mac-mini now, so can also do some test on that.

but my mac is  not setup for C coding ... (yet)

I use visual C++ studio express.  (free and simple)

Ah, ok... I build on the Mac-Mini here as well... because it by far 
shows me more coding errors than anything else... yep, the big endian 
smacks hard.

hehe

What size is that? C++ S.E.

had dun with unicode   I guess  ;-)

So, the plan is to try go get the build mechanism setup again for 
the host development method.

Then, I'll probably just drop you a zip of everything for you to 
try it and tell me what problems pop up.

A few days of smoothing it out... and we should be good to go.  But 
note...

installed... 226MB  (seems to include a few extra tools like C# and 
VB

I want to migrate the graphics dialects (parsed via DELECT) into 
COMMANDS (yes, like in extensions).

do we have some access to R3 funcs into Extensions?

(from extentions)

That's a big topic. One we should move elsewhere, because it's likely 
to be many pages long.

Anyway, I'll put together a more detailed plan and get it to you. 
 I want this to go quickly, but not waste any of our time.

be sure that the moment I get some form of host code or plan I'll 
react to it ASAP.  This is the main "holding back" of R3 right now 
IMHO.

Got to go... but I'll work on a core-only host package for tonight. 
That's a good way to sync up, because the whole thing is simpler 
to make and link.