AltME groups: search

255.255.255.0 is what used to be know a Class C mask

usually happens to me .. that I have to reboot after a failure of 
the name server

I think world names can expire after 10 days of disuse, so if light 
use means taking a couple of weeks off

Have you clearly documented this in a FEEDBACK post?

OK, I know we've covered this before but how do I remove myself from 
a group (Christianity in this case). This is what I tried:

1. Right click the group

2. Click on my username on the right hand side and observe it move 
to the left ... so far so good

3. Click save and get a dialog that says, "You must include yourself 
in the group."

4. Cancel to dismiss the dialog (I figure "Delete" is asking for 
trouble at this stage)  ;)

???

it is a usability issue

Actually, this one is a bug + we can improve the UI, and will fix, 
and will improve.

Works like a charm (and quick too).

I recently got the recycle bug  on a single group of a small world 
(repeatdly ) untill someone else posted to that group.  (note my 
client was running on the same machine the world was running on)

Yeksoon, yes, something in Rebol from what we can tell.  I'm not 
quick to blame Rebol actually, but we have talked about this one 
with Carl, and on our next big update (which has a large rewrite 
in it) this bug WILL be gone.

We are annoyed by it also.  It hits me about 2 times a week, I run 
3 clients on my system most of the time.

Toggle GUI Elements have a tendancy to confuse me unless they are 
a radio button or checkbox where the meaning is clear.

Reichart, I really appreciate AltME.  It is a great application.

I makes getting help a lot faster.

Ammon, yeah, I agree.  We are slowly locking down what I call a "pattern 
language."  In other words using the same UI parts the same way everywhere.

In a world as large as this one, perhaps there should be a way to 
quickly view Group information such as descriptions.  Maybe even 
the ability to search the groups to see if a group relevant to your 
next post exists or if you should create a new group for the post.

what about a smaller planet, like Mars?

Such a feature would likely be quite usefull there as well...

Does AltME have a DCC file-send type of thing?

We have no current plan of support DCC.  We do have a plan of supporting 
file share on AltME, and already do on Qtask.

I want to use Worldmaster dividers with some slight changes... SO, 
a way to choose Worldmaster dividers, then edit them for a custom 
one, would be nice

choose custom dividers, but start with a clone of Worldmaster?

I spent a few clock cycles on them thinking it was some puzzle.  
then something else shiny caught my attention.

Yep Brian, that's it.


I'm gonna try something.. I was looking around the AltMe folders, 
and found a file that looked like all it contained were dividers. 
 I'll copy AltMe to a new folder (backup) and copy the Worldmaster 
one over my Custom on

We plan to clean it up, and write a paper that explains it all, for 
example, you can actually dump all your grpahics, and then replace 
them all.

I got another request that I think will be cool.  Add a private option 
to the calendar so that it can be run in a local mode so that the 
data isn't shared.  I would think it would be easy to add it since 
the calendar is already created.

Also, any chance of getting a standalone version of that Calendar 
:-)

assumming the next version of alrme allows multiple worlds open, 
I would like to be able to set which (if any) notifies you when it 
gets a message posted.

note: I don't tell you guys what is planned to annoy you, just in 
case it was taken that way, I just try to give you feedback so you 
know a) I'm listening, b) if we don't have it to add it to feedbackl.

just out of curiousity... assuming skinning is supported..

is it skinning on a world-by-world basis?

Has anyone had any problems with getting Altme working thru a proxy?

I go out of town once a month, and have to use a squid proxy.  I 
can get IE, Firefox, and one of my own rebol apps to work thru the 
proxy, but not AltME.

Proxies are one of those things where every company has a slightly 
different way of  getting bent out of shape about some format, so 
we figured we would test for one path, and then leanr what everyone 
else complained about.

it loads, but gives me a script load error, as if it was not able 
to decrypt the code within...

gave feedback over a week ago, but still no reply...

is it a generalized SDK issue?  I am thinking of using SDK on those 
machines... do you think its bound to fail?

So our next update is coming along, aside from any features we are 
planning to include in the next build of AltME, we are looking for 
a new top 10 list of features or bugs for an interim release.


Please take some time to think about this before posting, in an attempt 
to keep this post clean and simple.


Even if you have posted to feedback in the past, I'm look for what 
is most important to you.


Also, the Recycle bug is being fixed, but can't be for this interim 
build, since it is part of the new architecture.

Reichart, One feature I posted a long time ago but not inside yet 
;-) --> "Mark All messages as read"

Hm...  Top Ten...  Some of these undoubtedly will be held for the 
new architecture, but here's my top requests...


1) Group level settings for message notification (activate window, 
play sound)
2) Group name/description search

3) Opt out of public groups so that the group remains public but 
you don't see it.

4) Alphabetical listing of users in group properties (Who's in the 
group, who's not)

5) Navigaion (Forward, Backword) buttons would be really helpful 
particularly when browsing checklists OR clicking on the checklist 
button replaces the group lists with checklists.

6)  When you right click a message then a popup shows telling you 
the text has been copied. This is nice but annoying because you can't 
hit Enter and watch it disappear. I'd personally really prefer a 
context menu but if it just dissappeared after 3 seconds or so that 
would be good too.

line by line scrolling ... and particularly in lists where it is 
almost impossible to select a  single usre in a very long list

(1) mark all messages in all groups as read (handy is your not online 
for a long time)

(2) There are some bugs in the proxy configuration reading. mixedup 
config settings etc...
(3) Scaling Fonts..very handy for the disabled readers

(4) Web Interfacing towards ALTME! instead of using the client use 
a webinterface, no problems with proxy's etc anymore...i hope ;-)
(5) ALTME API/SDK... for users to build bots ;-)

(2) Mark all messages as read (all groups)
(3) Remove yourself from a group
(4) APIs for external authN / authZ / ...

Thanks for asking :-)

[1] Fix the resync bug so I don't to use the dot & guest tricks

[2] Don't throw away what I've typed when I press enter just because 
you need to reconnect
[3] Much, much faster search

[4] multi-world search -- should search all the worlds I specify, 
not just the current one
[5] Ability to opt out (and back in) to a Public world

[6] Don't delete messages from  my copy of a world just because the 
master has been restored from a backup

[7] Ability to restrict Guests in various ways (eg can only post 
to certain groups / can only see other groups)

[1] Grouping of calendar events so you can filter select which type 
or with whom, specific calendar events are shared with, for display.
[2] Weekview in the calendar to fit more events pr. day

[3] Events from calendar formatted as a chronological TODO or activity 
list

[4] Export the calendar as HTML (it's a real problem if you have 
many events per day and can only see a small amount of them)

[5] Dynamic width of the user/group list to the left. Many group 
titles are chopped off.
[6] Filter search in the Users and Groups list

[7] Bigger/adjustable text area size in checklist entries, so it 
would be more suitable to store makedoc2 formatted documents in them 
(instant document repository!)

[8] Export checklists in makedoc2 format for integration in other 
makedoc2 docs

[9] Checklists as a column view. It would mean for Checklists: Spreadsheets 
that Checklists are in the left column and Spreadsheets are in the 
right column. You can select other checklists immediately without 
having to go back to the top and select a new one.

[10] Generally resizable windows everywhere. Small text areas are 
annoying!

:-)

(1) Allowing translation (external language file with program strings)
(2) Ability to mark all messages as read
(3) Font size settings
(4) Users rights (limited guest account would be a good step)

(1) Mark read position ("I've read up to here."). Sometimes I also 
like to quickly scan a group which may have a really long discussion 
in it, but I don't want it to be automatically marked as read, because 
I'm actually doing something else more important.

(2) Save selected messages. Some messages contain real gems worth 
saving and refining.

The ability to copy and paste just part of a post.

I agree and I suggested such in my post above... "I'd personally 
really prefer a context menu"

I don't think that restricting guest would be a good thing, i got 
in because of this community and the fact that i can get help from 
any of the gurus here ( yes it is nice to know who you are talking 
to).  But some people need reassurance  if they have a problem ( 
rebol /core /view /AltME etc. ) that someone will be able to help

1) FAST Message scroll-list with 'streaming' so I can browse/search 
in all messages in a group on the disk without need to setup the 
buffer in preferences and loose the performace and memory. (Get rid 
of the "Message cannot be shown. See Settings panel to allow older 
messages (Limit)." requester)

perhaps to bookmark a particular message ?

regarding Bookmarks

Maybe a way to put the marked messages in a special group "Bookmarks".

If I click on a selected message in this group the original group 
will be opened similar to the Search window.

Links

 groups should be a different style of view (different as checklists 
 are different). An editable list of links.

(...perhaps. Maybe it's better to try to keep them as a regular group, 
but just expand the flexibility of regular groups...)

Feature Req: 'Clear All'.  If I am away (say two days) from altme.. 
I come back /login only to find all groups highlighted with messages 
since my logoff.  Sometimes, I want to know what happened since I 
left.. however other times I just want to start clean.  So, I think 
that it would be nice to have a button or a pref that allows those 
highlighted groups to be cleared upon logging in.  This way, I can 
be assured that I am looking at new messages only.. not messages 
from 47 hours ago.     John.

Yeah.. if you do a new install on a new pc .. you have to click hundreds 
of times to clear the reds.  Computers are made to reduce work, so 
should offer an mass deredding.

Exactly.  Today, I opened up altme and had to click on every group. 
 It took me about 6 minutes.   Yes.. I can do this everytime, but 
I like how Graham put it.. "computers are made to reduce work..". 
 So, I think this would be a good feature.   Thanks for all the feedback 
people.  :-)

G, that is a diff prob.  We plan to solve that by allow you to store 
what you have read on the server.

0) multiple fallback mechanisms for getting/staying connected.

1) absolute control of what is actualy removed from local machine... 
ever.

2) better support for using a single account from several machines.
3) better support for using several worlds from one computer.

4) finer control of what posts you are exposed to. (groups and users 
and users in groups) 
5) filesharing
6) api,locks, so we can muck with the filesets.

7) calendar,just fix it up. hour/day/week views, sorting,repeated,various 
alerts ...
8) adjustable font sizes

9) search should return hits (the text) from further back than your 
message buffer limit.
10) OSX support & recycle bug

For deREDing  groups : just add a button in the top right near Search, 
Setup...

RebolJohn - 6 mins? I switched on a PC that I don't connect very 
often and cleared them all in 2 mins of clicking. My problem is when 
you clear the RED, but dont have time to read them all, you forget 
that they are really Unread and dont go back to read them.

Thats cool.. I am just suggesting a possible feature for the new 
altme.  The main point of the feature is that it would be a button 
/ option that you press or select.  If you don't want them cleared.. 
don't push it.

I think of communication software a little differently (in general), 
so I will share this.  

Read states

 (like the Red we are talking about) are a very interesting issue. 
  


Most computer software does a very poor job of replicating empirical 
or visceral conversations.  Email for example has a method of describing 
the "direction" you are speaking.  TO: Bob, CC: Carry.  Where the 
TO: indicates you are speaking directly to Bob, and that Carry is 
standing somewhere to the left or right of you.  BCC is someone hiding 
behind you. 


Email could have an interface where you first pick the people in 
the "room." And then use something like a 2D interface to move the 
listeners around a symbolic version of you.  This would be both silly, 
time consuming, and somewhat confusing, but you get the point.


What you have read and what you have not read though has a similar 
analogy.   There are thousands of sub states and markers people use 
to sort things they have read, will read, need to read again, need 
to respond to, etc.


In Box, Out Box, Papers upside down, putting papers you need to sign 
under your car keys on the floor in front of the door leading to 
the car, etc.


I have one friend who re-wrote some open source email program to 
have some huge number of states and then some simple filters.  It 
works VERY WELL, if you know his system.  He never forgets anything.


So the current model AltME has (right now) is a very simple interface. 
 Tantimount to "Have I ever seen this before."


We are playing with some other models in Qtask, which may get adopted 
into AltME.  I'm working on a system I call Venn Chat.  Some features 
include:

Have I read this before? (like AltME)
Mark this:  

Follow up (add to a list of messages you want to think about more)
Note (All should read this when they come into the group)
All Must Read (converts it into an AltME-like alert)


Convert to a task (and keep the context of the chat in place, this 
is opens up a whole other area)
Branch (something like forum threading)
Re-file (move from one group to another)

Re-post (copy to another group, at the same time, similar to branch).
Trigger (tell me when someone has finally read this).
Status (tell me who has read this so far).
Attach (files, links, etc)

Then there is the whole voting thing like Slashdot.


Allowing people to mark stuff important, NOT important, Humour, etc.

Which then brings up the whole statistical nature of "your value" 
as a person.


So for example, almost everyone in a religion group is marking entries 
as "interesting" or "important," but you are marking it "Humour."


The system can assume that you do not carry the "common" vote and 
value your vote accordingly.  But as this example demonstrates, it 
would need to be both at the global and local level (group, project, 
world, etc.)


Some people ONLY comment when something really is important, the 
system would note this.  So "Bob" for example only notes code samples 
that are really good examples of Rebol.  As a result, you could create 
a filer to just see "Bob's Picks."  Or thresholds based on certain 
people.


You could also block people that fall below a certain number. And 
then you wold never need to read my babblings.

1. 	A switch to turn off notification about new messages. On XP, 
the minimized window's icon blinks for every new message, which can 
become a little bit annoying.


2. 	A switch to 'subscribe' only selected groups - in a sense of 
"Only mark group with new messages if subscribed". 

 Otherwise, get message silently but don't mark group red for having 
 unread messages.


3. 	A "newer than new" feature: Whilst AltME is online and one is 
working in another app, inform (in a popup window or alike) when 
one returns to it: "New messages in the following groups:" 

 which can easily be clicked away if none of the groups are of special 
 interest.

Reichart, I like your ideas.

I would guess that one of the goals should be to pick a 'realm of 
inclusiveness' (I don't know what else to call it).

i.e. If AltMe is suppose to be fashioned as a message-logger then 
these 'new messages' should be flagged until read.

However, if AltMe is suppose to be fashioned as a meeting-place then 
maybe 'new messages' should only be flagged after you log in.


Now, don't get me wrong here.. I am not saying that messages shouldn't 
show up at all, I am stating that their container wouldn't be flagged 
(red).

A real-world example of this is.. someone going to a party.

The party is in full-swing and the newcomer would venture from group-discussion 
to group-discussion.

i.e. Now that I am at the party, I know there is repeated 'hot discussions' 
going on with that group over there (altMe).. while the group in 
the corner (mysql) isn't talking.. they are just eating their chips 
and sitting quietly.

And to parallel this.. when I join AltMe for the day.. I would not 
be flagged of old-conversations that happened while I was logged 
off.. I would only be flagged of conversations that are happening 
since I logged on.

Now, that doesn't keep me from going to those other groups and seeing 
the messages that have been posted while I was logged off, it just 
keeps me in touch with the party.

1. Better notification to user of a message. "Slide up window?" Reichart, 
you know this is my favorite.
2. Calendar - Ability to add more events. Alarms for events
3. File sharing
4. Programmable sounds for people/groups.
5. "Take back last entry"

James...yes.  Working on that tech, talked about it with Carl just 
the other day.  We are attempting to make a SysTray app right now.

1.  link tasks with the calendar

2.  "clear all" a simple button which removes red color of all groups. 
usefull when skipping a few days...

3.  HIDE groups (and users).  just add simple check mark to  window 
which lists all available groups and any you check-off are removed 
from the list you look at (yet you still receive their posts, if 
you want to look at them another time).

4.  per group moderators for private AND public groups (delete posts, 
insert posts, manage users, etc.   A part from "opting out", users 
are not able to change the setup (like deleting the group), group 
name, list of users in private group, etc ).  

5.  single file export of all selected task lists and their tasks 
(ascii or html)

6.  SORT task list... we cannot sort the task lists... only the tasks 
they contain... a real bitch when working with others...

7.  Also allows read-only mode for private groups for people not 
in private users list.   Great to manage announcements for private 
tools.
8.  'workdays only - weekend only' option for calendar

9.  properly support hours in calendar tasks, so that hours are always 
available, right now, the software often ignores any data we put 
in the hours field..

I think we just need a field above the user/group list, when you 
start typing it starts limiting the list just like your cell phone's 
contact list...

Most cellphones compare letter for letter (i.e. if I type "a" then 
only the contacts whos' name starts with a are going to be displayed.) 
But I would opt for full name searching so that if the name has an 
a in it then it would show up in the list...

Features:

9) Ability to set how far back you want to have 'Red' groups highlighted. 
 For example, you are a new user and downloaded a years worth of 
content, but only want to see the last two weeks of contributions.

Look at the world networking ... you can see arie asking a question 
 that is different from maxim.  So far it is hard to find out what 
was the last response to maxim ( unless you read all the way down 
to the last answer on that world  ).

If you could separate them by topics it would be a lot easier know 
the last answer for maxim or arie. You can focus better on the question 
(or answers).

If we can understand it, it's good enough  (^.-)  And that idea is 
a pretty good one, actually - similar to the [subject] blocks we 
use in the mailing list

like a thread without branches basically.. I forgot to put that in 
my wish list... it would have been # 1

This seems to be something to fix/change - AltME couldn't connect 
a few minutes ago, and IE wouldn't load any websites - I ran Ad-Aware 
and removed 17 tracking cookies.  As soon as they were gone, IE worked 
-and- AltME connected..

Is Rebol or AltME dependant on Internet Explorer?

Next time that happens I'll need to experiment a little..

whish-list: mark a message for other people. kind of headlines in 
a group. idea: if we fill an important group with chat, we could 
mark up the topic-entries later. like "Carl: about syntax:".

'dot' it


whenever u feel that AltMe or the world is a bit too quiet.. send 
a dot to yourself..or to some group

I thought that's what the 'dot' group was for... Funny how Dot Fever 
starts whenever there's a new world  =^þ

Need a paging feature whereby we can click on a persons name and 
have it play a wav file on their computer to get their attention 
and flash.

If anyone knows a good chat client has altme like features of self 
archiving dialogue and paging features please let me know as I have 
some immediate needs for that.

Messenger Plus adds a bubch of extra features on top of IM .. http://www.msgplus.net/
. Be careful on the the install and opt out of the install "spyware" 
option. I haven't kept up with latest IM, so I don't know how many 
of this guys original idea have been rolled back into IM. But in 
terms of paging, you can trigger different sounds via messenger plus

coloring of active groups are very hard to see for me on this monitor. 
the red color blends too much with black for me. it would be nice 
if there was a graphical indicator such as a dot next to the group 
to better see which group has been updated.

One nice thing would be, if some userdata would be saved along with 
my login, like colours, and read messages in the different groups. 
I just now installed altme on a new computer, and I have to fill 
in all of this.

the default background and foreground colors.  I prefer dark background 
and dark text, and if no one has specifically chosen a font, it would 
be kindest if that text showed up in my default (or at least pickable) 
colors.  I don't mind if it doesn't look to the environment to know 
those colors, as long as I can turn down the light.  the column with 
the names it wouldn't matter

small feature request: allow images typed in here, such as http://someurl.com/an_image.jpg
to be viewed in a popup-window rather than launching in a browser. 
would that be 3-5 lines of code? just allow the url to be recognized 
as a jpg, gif, png, bmp or whatever and view it here much faster 
and more convenient.

Yeah, I'm REALLY anti FTP.  It took us writing our own FTP Client 
to realize, FTP is simply not worth supporting, the people who originated 
it were kids, that did not know what they were doing.  We waste too 
much time, as has everyone that has written FTP client or Server 
software.


Basically, the standard should be rewritten such that every command 
that a normal DOS would use are available, even the simple stuff 
like getting the size of the volume the data is being stored on, 
and remaining space.


But also there needs to be systems in place for check-summing files 
in usable chunks, and also for doing metrics from both sides so that 
better predictions can be made about the time it will take to synch.

It goes on and on, just throw FTP away…


Build an x-internet interface to something new, and build it correctly 
to be global not local.


For example, every block (some unit of bytes) of a given file should 
be able to exist in multiple places (on the web, not just on a server), 
etc.

Let's solve everything in one place once and for all.

wow, I just figured out the subliminal message of AltME brand.  The 
user becomes a new "ME" because of being reborn into the communications/collaboration 
age.  It ain't the same old me, it's the AltME.

How about browsing a users webserver? means altme would launch a 
browser to the users dial-up IP. Could be usefull for writing web-documents, 
quick turnarounds.

We have a small private world and guess what? We deleted the master. 
Now we can't change anything. Is there any way to get the master 
back?

What im missing actualy in ALTME is a GLOBAL "lock" on all the ALTME 
windows..!! Just 1 button that locks all the IO with mouse and keyboard 
on the ALTME input fields..

PS: a feature im using on my chat tool too and its sometimes very 
handy!

I'm not following, need a more verbose description.

Yes its like volker says..Just a Display input, I often happens that 
by accident you type someting and hit enter.. ALTME can be used for 
Read-only in that case too.. Just to prefent yourself or someone 
else behind your PC for dropping data into input fields...

instead of typing/pasting a warning "remember you are not really 
here" ;)

R they want a button , like the 'gone' button that when active prevents 
altme from accepting input

When trying to type, flash the "unlock" icon (instead of further 
annoying the user by popping a requestor).

A new user, not knowing and surprised by the lock, then is tempted 
to ask "what the hell is this flashing icon ?", presses it, then 
gets the message, "keyboard unlocked" - "ahh.. I see!"

Probably better yet: Do both. And put a "Don't show this dialog again" 
check-box into the popup-requester. I don't appreciate very much 
depending on user's curiosity to find out how things work.