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Gald you got it downloaded in the end.
The indexes are close to real time.

It is possible for the owner of a package like qmr-ed to make it 
unavailable while they are updating it. maybe that happened this 
time.

btw, if you have suggestions, please let me know. i'll be working 
a bit more on it on monday.

sunanda I am getting an error from the server itself!  


whenever I press download, it starts the download (shows the green 
xfer data on the bottom, and then pops up an error:  here is the 
error as reported by LDS:

make object! [
    status: [100 20 "bad cgi data"]
    data: none
    diagnostics: [9003 9003 9.8084E-2]
    supply-date: 15-Sep-2006/1:03:41
]


have any idea where that is comming from?  I try to check it out 
from the code I have... but its been sooo long, A nudge on your part 
will help me get this working much faster IMHO!

pow!  all fixed  :-)  just need to let slim  build the new release 
from all the included files and we are set !  I will also be doing 
just a little bit of cleanup within GLayout to reduce the size of 
the final single-file app...

Thanks Maxim,

I'll try to get the new version up and live in a few days -- I'm 
pretty busy myself right now.

new version uses slick new version of GLayout which has gfx partly 
based on Henrik tests which he supplied a few weeks ago...

as usuall, type the following in a rebol console to open up the tool.

do http://www.rebol.org/library/public/repack.r


also note that I put a lot of effort in optimizing the file's final 
size, including a lot of hacking out, removing comments, compressing, 
etc... its now a much smaller download.

We are glad to announce that a newer version of the rebol.org package 
downloader is now available for people using REBOL|view 1.3.2

as usuall, type the following in a rebol console to open up the tool. 
it now adapts to version automatically
<pre>do http://www.rebol.org/library/public/repack.r</pre>

also note that I put a lot of effort in optimizing the file's final 
size, including a lot of hacking out, removing comments, compressing, 
etc... its now a much smaller download.
This version uses a slick 
new version of GLayout which has gfx largely based on Henrik's tests 
which he supplied a few weeks ago...

my pleasure... only strange that my last post ended up  here... it 
was a copy/paste of info in this group meant for another group.. 
hum...

cause I'm a control freak  ;-)

the file browser allows you to create dirs... although I admit auto-creation 
of typed paths in the field is a good idea (maybe with a little req 
asking for confirmation)

using official REBOL style guide and wrapping every lib within a 
CTX object and possibly an extra function which exposes the words, 
instead of forcing them directly using 'set.

maybe officializing a naming convention so they have a distinct name, 
making them easy to identify by peers.

maxim, a script wiki?

http-tools is a good example.  I have some stuff, you have some stuff, 
there is A LOT of it here and there.

it would become public domain, meaning you relinquish rights to what 
you submit, unless someone wants to organize a rebol source foundation, 
and then we can have the foundation be the authorised copyright owner 
of the peer-reviewed libs.

but this is a closed world, it gets lost,  some ppl leave,  and it 
prevents the platform to grow.  seems like we are always rebooting 
the community every few years...

well, I guess that's how things are right now. I do find it to be 
a bit elitist, you have to ask permission to come in here and most 
of the people know each other somewhat.

the IRC channels I visit can be a bit the same. It's like being a 
stranger walking into a bar full of people who know each other very 
well. either you are accepted or not.


The elitist thing is not meant at anyone here, but I think it can 
be seen as elitist from the outside. :-)

There have been a number of initiatives in this area, but none have 
taken hold. I think it's *very* important, and have wanted it for 
a long time, but the hard part is coming up with a design that will 
work for everyone, since there is no standard for modules and libraries. 
I'm hoping R3's module design will address this, and give us the 
common ground we need to do something like this.

Part of the "problem" is that REBOL is really built for programming-in-the-small 
today, and being interpreted, you can't optimize out things you don't 
need--not without a preprocessor of some kind. It also lends itself 
to simple, direct word use, not the more verbose context/func approach. 
That makes it harder to build effective libraries. 


I've often thought that the best approach might be a simple library 
of "global" functions, which would basically add to the available 
words in REBOL, so they should be very generic, and there might be 
a lot of them. More complex modules would be contexts, and we'd need 
an agreed upon system for naming, exported words, etc.

Collecting things is a good first step, but then we quickly need 
to consider something like Ladislav's #include function  and a context/module 
standard.

I'm not saying its perfect.  never have, but it was supposed to be 
a starting point where people could agree on a platform for sharing 
code.

its funny that Gregg brings this up (again) cause I was chatting 
to sunanda about setting up  a special part of rebol.org.

All this would need is a few conspirators who manage the code submission 
in order to classify them and make sure they comply to a clear manifesto.,

then we would have a useable set of professional interworking toolsl 
which will grow instead of runing in circles.

rebol.org has many nice features.  but I feel (and sorry for being 
open and blunt) that its a tough resource to use.

wrt slim, people might say its not documented... well, it was all 
documented on the web for a long time... but that didn't change anything. 
 And I can't be the only one providing all the answers for such a 
community oriented project.  Other people have to jump in.  The list 
of advanced features within slim is too long to list here, but it 
has many things even python coders wish they had.

so  I ask this, is anyone willing to put a little bit of time where 
their mouth is... and help me organize the content of rebol.org.

I am not talking about adopting slim as it is.  it maybe too full-featured. 
 but we need a common reference.  and people underestimate how Carl 
perceives the work done by the community.  If the community tends 
to its own. and creates a precedent... I know Carl will be only too 
happy to work in the same direction.

I am willing to put a bit of time on structuring a vault of high-quality 
and re-useability functions and toolsets.  Is anyone ready to help 
me put some time on it  ? (speccing, coding, refactoring current 
sources,  and/or management of submission of new code).

Maxim


I also personally feel that Rebol really needs an easy-to-use, well-organised 
standard library. (Ruby Gems seems to be a very good model). 


I will be willing to help once I have done a few of the things that 
I have promised to do

ok I will make a discussion for this:  revault   (just a working 
name)

Apologies -- REBOL.org was unavailable for just under a day, it's 
back now.

The problem originated with the ISP, and it took them a little while 
to work out what they'd done wrong.

Using a "non-standard" language seems to have added to their debug 
time:
Extracts from two emails from the ISP's technical support:

<<Hi, Sunanda.  Sorry this is taking a bit.  As I'm sure you know 
you have

a non-standard setup :-)  We aren't familiar with it and are puzzling 
it

out.  Am I right that you have your own scripting language?  And 
that
[snipped] is the [path to the] interpreter?>>

<<Aha!  Our web server rebooted yesterday.  It's a FreeBSD server, 
and for

a reason we haven't determined yet, the Linux compatability module

didn't load.  We loaded it and your site works again.  We'll figure 
out
why that module didn't load at boot.>>

Hi. This is the qmail-send program at yahoo.com.

I'm afraid I wasn't able to deliver your message to the following 
addresses.

This is a permanent error; I've given up. Sorry it didn't work out.

<[lists-:-rebol-:-com]>:
xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx does not like recipient.

Remote host said: 550-"The recipient cannot be verified.  Please 
check all recipients of this
550 message to verify they are valid."
Giving up on xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx.

--- Below this line is a copy of the message.

Sorry, hit return to soon.  The above is supposed to be preambled 
with a whine about me not getting into the mailing list.  I can't 
talk to lists spat rebol spot com.  And I just noticed I didn't mungle 
the list email in above.  I mungled  IP addressed to xxx.

tomc troubleshoots the ML -- a message here to him usually gets a 
quick response

550 is a server error

It would certainly be nicer to have shorter URLs. We inherited the 
use of CGIWRAP (which is creating all the long URLs), and were not 
able to remove it when we started. That's a great pity.

What I'd realy like is for the server to be running apache 2, so 
we could read the REDIRECT variables in the 404 handler. Then we 
could do pretty much any amount of rewriting of URLs intelligently 
in a REBOL script.
Sadly, we are still on 1.3 with no hope of an early upgrade.

Dear Library Team,


   I've only got a single script in the library, but I like it, and 
   I'd like it to live through the R3 update.

Are there any plans for adding explicit rebol versioning to scripts 
that want to stand the test of time?


   Is having multiple binaries on target REBOL platforms a no-no?  Meaning, 
   could the released binary packages for REBOL 3.0 include REBOL 1.3 
   (2.7) executables so scripts don't age out as fast as they did when 
   going from 1.2 to 1.3?  A little bit of configuring on the host OS 
   to start the correct REBOL by extension, shebang, or resource fork 
   on MacOS?  Can DO add a secret launch of older/other binary if a 
   Needs: is specified?

Curious.

Graham;  Yeah, sorry, I knew I was bringing up two seperate points. 
 Should have mentioned it.  I'm just hoping the 700+ scripts in the 
library don't go to waste when everyone goes R3.  A little/lotta 
work on RT's part, a little/lotta work on the Library Teams shoulders...

Sunanda is the go-to guy on this, but we do have a tested-under field 
in the library header. At least that way you would have a clue if 
something was known to work under R3.

So I'll add a little/lotta work on contributor shoulders as well 
then?  Just that some contributors may be ex-rebols by now.  :)

Someday we'll have a slick auto-test system that runs each script 
under every known version of REBOL and gives a red or green light 
for each one. Of course, that means we need a test engine....result 
logging...Hmmm, might not happen right away. :-)

Graham;  Ok.  Credit where credit due.   I still want Mr. Irwin offering 
up hints and guidance, the same as I expect you to keep things on 
a nice shiny track as well.  :)

{Altme lost the first version of this post)

We don't as yet know the extent of the incompatibilities between 
R3 and previous versions.

The more incompatibilites there are, the bigger a problem we all 
have: most of us have personal libraries of useful functions (code 
snippets etc). If we cannot trust them to work under R3, then we 
all have a hiatus while we fix our code.

The Library itself already has some problems with this.

The Libraty code (lots of it) runs under an outdated version of REBOL.

And that has trouble doing a load/header on scripts written for later 
verisons.

It's an annoyance at the moment, and not worth fixing yet if we have 
to go through another remediation to fix code for R3

That would be a good solution, Graham, if:
1. it were able to then load and run the right .exe

2. the whole software stack runs the same version......Imagine the 
annoyance if you need one utility that needs and earlier / later 
executable? (I don't need to imagine that; it's happened already 
for me)

Sunanda; I'm not a g-level rebol yet, but if you need to off load 
any mundane time-wasting low-brain work, send it this way and I might 
be able to help...willingness is there...skill? dunno.  :)

eeek! rare sighting report -- a rebol volunteer!!

its getting a bit last minute IMHO.

hum pekr and me in the same room.. will people be able to stand such 
a tidal wave of "negativity"  ;-)

you don't even have to stress with a priority  :-)

I understand everybody is waiting for the organizers to pick a hotel 
so everybody can  stay at the same place.

maybe not everybody, but a few of us yes.

The people from Paris are now checking several possible hotels do 
achieve this. But it is likely that it will not be possible, because 
the conference is taking place in a period when many other colleges 
and universities (Sorbonne,...) are actually organising conferences. 
So are most hotels not able to welcome groups of persons.

I am wondering if there will be a place for people to meet, show 
off and exchange stuff as a group... later during the evening/night?

Website updated with some hotels data; it seems not possible to get 
a central place for everybody down there, for the reason given earlier.Sorry 
for that...

Carl and I are staying at the Hotel Excelsior on rue Cujas.  It has 
good prices, large rooms, internet access, and a patio.  An other 
good choice for the area is Hotel Desmines.

I'm planning to come to the DevCon (my lovely wife will be joining 
me).


Since I will be in Europe, and I can stay longer, if anyone would 
like to meet (for example about Qtask), this would be a good time 
to speak up.  Feel free to post to me privately….

I'm looking for a place later this year

Reichart: i'd love to have a long talk about qtask and all the other 
stuff :) but i assume you are planning that already.

new session added:  "Rencontre: a Rebol Agent-Oriented Middleware" 
by François Jouen

Useful hint for those preparing a DevCon presentation :-)
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/04/04/powerpoint_bad/

Geomol, I see you wrote: "So if you're a programmer, system developer 
or the like, it might be a good idea to visit a REBOL DevCon!"


I hope there will be beginner's sessions? That might attract a few 
more people.

Yeah, I liked the videos from a couple years ago.

gabriele, do you want a smaller timer this year? :-)

(actually, i'd want a much bigger one, that just shuts down the pc 
after the allotted time)

Content of Carl's presentation was updated:

Introducing REBOL 3.0
 by Carl Sassenrath

(The content will be spread in probably more than one session)

Opening and a historical note.


What makes a system popular? Is it the language, the platform, or 
the applications? The bigger picture: the virtual OS. Moving beyond 
conventional OS models. Being a latform. The core of modern applications 
- it's not what you think.


The motivation for R3. The guiding theme. Portablity and extensibility 
- the R3 open foundation. Overview of R3 features.


Environments - embedding REBOL. Building your own version of REBOL 
- within a standard. Plugins - extending REBOL. The IO device model 
- how to create a device.


New datatypes. The Module architecture. Tasks, threads, and more. 
The new graphics system. All new port design. New debugging methods. 
New object tricks. DB access nd indexed files. IPv6 discussion. Compatibility 
- taming the lion. What's next? When and where can you get a copy? 
The goal of DevBase and DocBase.

It is really a pity I can't go to  Paris :-(

there is probably a typ? "Being a latform" should probably be "Being 
a platform"?

Anyone organising a little tour? just a few cars, tagging along in 
paris either on wednesday or during the week-end after...

That's good, because I don't make it this year :-(. I have a very 
important meeting on Firday.

just upload - that is not really correct, as video length is limited 
to just a few minutes.

maybe you need special permissions to upload more... like if you 
are a very active user or post very good videos they reward you with 
more time.

I remember reading on an Amiga gaming site that you can uplaod large 
files but need to go thru a process with youtube first and then all 
is good

revver: We do have a size restriction of 100MB per file

I am now in Frankfurt, and will be in Paris in a few hours. (It has 
been a long trip - 18hrs.)

otherwise, they ought to be broadcastable with a REBOL program, changing 
slides on a client, when you change them :-) shouldn't be so hard 
to do.

ah, so maybe just a storm

I've set up a wiki at http://devcon2007.on-arran.com/(template to 
match the official DevCon site).  I'd be obliged if willing DevCon 
attendees would create pages with revelations and announcements from 
the conference, and also if non-attendees could help keep it organised.

I've called it a LiveWiki, in the spirit of Live Blogging I've seen 
from other conferences.

I need some info on when or where and how I should do a video conference....

Thanks Chris: great idea!

I've updated  the Latest Info page, and added a page about the Library 
presentation ... including a link to the presentation itself. Please 
feel free to read it a ay in advance.

Shucks, I wish I was there.  I was planning to go, but I have 3 REBOL-based 
products/projects going full steam which have been busy already for 
some months, and have no spare time for the next few months at least. 
 I wanted to show the wireless device I am working on at this conference. 
 I will try to post a video of it in the next day or 2.

It's a display and software which can go into many products, and 
does graphical messaging with very low bandwidth needs.

Absolutely...Once a REBOL addict, always one...no better way to do 
it!  My specialty is in proprietary embedded applications, so nearly 
all of my products never see the light of day of the public, but 
are industrial applications.  This one will be very public, however, 
but I have kept it under tight wraps.   I have several customer demos 
to do this week and next here in the USA.  We will be licensing it 
to various phone manufacturers and remote delievery areas.

hmm, it would be cool, if those devices could run Rebol OS one day. 
With R3 that is a possibility one day :-)

I especially liked R3's move to device model with a note, that you 
could get rebol console to serial port - I thought to myself - holly 
hell, that would be something :-)

I guess there would be a good priority in targetting certain embedded 
devices, like the Soekris motherboards.

I am targeting a much lower cost than that.

Guys, have a good time at the DevCon... I'm just 500km away on the 
exact same latitude as Paris. Hope to be there again next year.

had a very wonderfull meal and talk with most of the attendees over 
pizza and beer...  :-)  


tomorrow will be very exciting...  R3 sounds like its going to be 
"kick ass"  (quoting Xavier Debecq here  ;-)

Sooo the conference starts in 20 minutes ... no live stream yet, 
I am a bit worried :-)

it would help a lot if the speaker had a microphone

video is pinky, sounds is good, although a bit jerky from time to 
time ...

crap... I have to leave for a few hours. bbl

well, I think it was not just a priority for initial R3 architecture 
release ...

Carl says Unicode issue is mainly the OS interface.....That will 
be part of the Open source part of REBOL....Hence need to find a 
Unicode expert to write / design it. It could be you, Petr!

like being there THANKS A LOT!!