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And is this a http timeout or a cheyenne timeout?

So, R3 Chat server has been moved to Dallas TX running in Cheyenne 
on a cloud.

probably a DNS issue... he has changed servers... so the IP surely 
has changed?

SVN revision 72: File uploading improvements (changes might break 
older scripts)


FEAT: File upload management improved, in-memory uploading removed 
for consistency.

FEAT: request/store specifications changed. Now it renames the temp 
file to its original name by default. Use the new /as refinement 
to move the file (see Changelog).

FEAT: New complete example of file uploading (client and server-side) 
in www/ folder.

FEAT: New config keyword: 'incoming-dir <%/path/> to specify a custom 
incoming folder per domain or per webapp.

Maybe a silly question, but why Carl uses:
  <% insert tail response/buffer request/posted %>
instead of:
  <% print request/posted %>

Yes... already posted as a comment to his blog.

Anyway.. I thought that APPEND is already a native in R2 as well. 
It's not.

Can someone give me some guidance on the following I keep getting 
a decoding error.

<%
 	fname: request/content/fname
   	lname: request/content/lname
   	spouse: request/content/spouse
	address: request/content/address
	city: request/content/city
	state: request/content/state
	zip: request/content/zip
	h_phone: request/content/h_phone
	c_phone: request/content/c_phone
	email: request/content/email

 do-sql 'bugs ["INSERT INTO names VALUES (?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?,?)"fname 
 lname spouse address city state zip h_phone c_phone email ]
%>

BTW, I normally do it this way

fname: any [ select request/content 'fname copy "" ]

so that the variable is always a string ...

Thanks Graham I'll give your methods a shot. I'm just a newbie trying 
to learn so I put the listed code together from what documentation 
I could find.

Is there any inbuilt way how to store per-session data which are 
not sent to client as a cookie?

RSP sessions purpose is to provide a way to store temporary persistent 
data efficiently (in memory) across client requests (the alternatives 
are storing data on disk in flat files or databases). RSP session 
data is lost when the session expires or when you restart Cheyenne 
without using the 'persist config directive.

Validate already assign a 'none value to missing parameters.

Request parameters are used to transport data from client to server. 
If a parameter is not sent, having 'none seems appropriate. Setting 
them to anything else "by default" will make you loose this important 
information.

I know, but than I can write as Graham var: any [select request/content 
'var <default value>] without validate... At least if the value is 
expected to be a string!.

I'll think about that in the next release. I have plans to improve 
the 'validate function to be able to specify more constraints. What's 
missing the most currently is an efficient way to map a list of words 
to a database record (especially for writing).

When the query is built, passed arguments are escaped depending on 
their own datatype and not depending on the target field in the table. 
This could be improved too by using an abstraction layer upon databases, 
giving you access to a logical data model instead of the physical 
model. I'm currently brainstorming on such abstraction layer to see 
the pros&cons.

Cheyenne's CGI handler reads the first 512 bytes of a CGI script, 
if it contains "REBOL" followed by a [, it loads the script and evaluates 
it. If header is not found, it reads the shebang line and run the 
script using CALL (so as a separate process). So, in order to run 
R3 scripts, you need to patch Cheyenne's CGI handler to run all scripts 
with CALL, or provide a R3 CGI script with shebang line and extra 
text (512 bytes) before the REBOL header (R3 should ignore the extra 
text).

Testing locally with latest SVN revision: it fails too. It's a regression. 
I'll fix it asap.

Good ... I guess ... I thought I had lost the ability to set a parameter. 
 If you are looking, I also had trouble with the worker-libs and 
had to enter absolute addresses to get them to work ... %/c/cheyenne/www/private/mysql-protocol.r

MikeL, I've added the alias issue to the new CC instance for Cheyenne. 
I let you add a ticket for the path issue with worker-libs.

For the CureCode I have set a new account request in and am getting 
no email. I went back to my Curecode R3 account and requested the 
password email and so far no email.  For new request, status says 
'account not yet activated'

From the logs on curecode.org, both emails have been rejected by 
your email SMTP server. It seems like a SMTP issue (not sure yet 
from if it is from the server or client side). Anyway, I've validated 
your CC accounts, so you can log in.

Ah good, maybe it was just delayed by a SMTP greylisting protection.

You need to patch 'logging event in mod-static to save them. There's 
probably a standard format from Apache for that.

You can also add a wish to CureCode for that feature if you want 
me to implement it. ;-)

I digged into it a little and I don't know how to make it load other 
than default language en

I don't know what is the right solution in the global context, differentyl 
calculated path , different current dir .. so it's best you solve 
it :) .. I made a hack/fix so I can work on

that static form for localised strings is a great idea #[...] 


does localisation effect performance much? I suppose it increases 
RAM usage since app holds the two hashtables in memory (which is 
needed I know for speed)

I don't recall anyone using the localization framework besides me 
and now you. :-) This framework is still experimental, it might be 
not suitable for a big application as it relies on a single namespace 
(using same words in differents pages will give you the same translation, 
this is not always desirable).

Please add a ticket for that issue at http://curecode.org/si/view-tickets.rsp.

I agree that #[...] really makes things easier and cleaner. Performance 
impact is not significant, the overhead is just a string! PICK in 
a block with a static index as argument (that's one of the nice advantage 
of compiling RSP scripts). OTOH, the SAY function has to do a hash 
table lookup to get the right index (so a tiny little bit slower 
than the literal form).

Good. I have a lot of javascript so #[] really saved my day. I had 
started with >element.innerHTML = "<%= say "some text" %>" and element.innerHTML 
= "#[some text]" is 10x better :)

I will add a ticket, I need to use this function because I basically 
set language globaly for english / slovene version (not based on 
user preferences or anything, it's also different website).

Some texts (that are part of application) are a little longer. I 
was thinking of replacing all of them with "tags", like "add_now" 
instead of "Add now" and "warning_text" instead of "bla bla ........................" 
and having the default language as this tag language from which it 
is then translated to english, slovene, etc.. anyone has any thoughts 
about this?


I could also make a tool that would statically replace all the values 
in say "..." and #[...] if I decide to do so at one time. That's 
why I would preferr the same system for most of things.


I will probably have a separate files where the whole page is text 
, like the instructions.

Looks like a good idea to dig.

I have a webapp that uses captcha as part of the authentication. 
 But I need also to allow scripts in ... and so I had to disable 
the captcha.  Any other solutions?

I got the SVN version. How to proceed?

a) how can I get the SVN version to run on my server?
b) how can I create an encapped version of it?

AFAIR no unless you are using a webapp

In order to use the mysql protocol, you have to include it as a worker-lib, 
I guess.

I see. I don't have SDK. Is there a license issue about mysql/odbc 
drivers or do you have a plan to put in next releases?

ODBC drivers are binary, and are only included if you have /Command 
or the SDK. Which also include a mysql driver, but not as good a 
driver as the free one linked above.

Well, that's a good idea, but the SDK license is quite restrictive, 
I shouldn't distribute Cheyenne in binary form (see "REBOL API Restriction" 
part at http://www.rebol.com/docs/sdk/sdkintro.html). RT didn't asked 
me to pay any additional license so far, so I don't want to push 
it further by giving away a free /Command with Cheyenne.

it is imo a bug. There is absolutly no reason why rebpro kernel should 
behave differently from other kernels in the SDK.

with init.d you have multiple files for different stages of startup 
and shutdown process so it's a little complicated.. the guy (he was 
on ubuntu showed me just one file where you add cli commands and 
that's it)

Graham, which version of Ubuntu are you using? The newest version 
of Ubuntu doesn't use the /etc/init.d system anymore, it uses upstart 
instead: http://upstart.ubuntu.com/getting-started.html.Much easier 
but less powerful (but maybe enough for you) is editing the /etc/rc.local 
file. That just starts an app after booting, it doesn't allow you 
to restart or stop it with a command. Just put the command to start 
up cheyenne on a line between "# By default this script does nothing." 
and "exit 0"

Even better though would be if you wrote a small demon script in 
rebol or bash or whatever you like, that gets started by rc.local 
instead of directly starting cheyenne. This demon would check all 
running tasks every 60 seconds and see if cheyenne is still running, 
otherwise restart it. This way, if cheyenne should crash, it is automatically 
restarted.

I'll have a look .. but I'm having issues now starting cheyenne. 
 I'm using the latest binary from doc but it just stops

I have to run cheyenne.r to allow it to create a cache.efs file and 
then I can run the binary

Is there a simple file upload script demo .... ?

this is for a non existent file

as for upload ... I used something I found that I wrote a few years 
ago :)

Here's a small bug fix for Cheyenne

I guess it's like the semicolon bug that made a space probe miss 
Jupiter by 100,000 km :-)

Is there a reason for this? The list on most Unix systems and Syllable 
Server is much more comprehensive

From earlier messages here, it was my understanding that Cheyenne 
on Linux can run its UniServe taskmaster processes under a non-root 
user account by enabling 'userdir in the modules and 'user and 'group 
in the globals

Here's a nice key-value store... Redis  http://code.google.com/p/redis/

(posting here.. wouldn't hurt to have a Cheyenne module for accessing 
this piece of art)

Spent the last couple of days grokking Redis.. you owe it to yourself 
to take a long look.

Now all we need is a Cheyenne protocol :)

I'm thinking about porting  Redis to Rebol as a datastore for Cheyenne, 
but I'm not sure of performance.. 

Redis is a key/value db like CouchDB, with a number of nice features 
(persistence etc.)


Now in Redis, I can create a db with 120,000 key / value pairs.. 
keys are integers from 1 - 120,000 (in this example) with a 10 byte 
string as the value

In redis, i can do 10,000 GETS (return the value of the key) in 1.39 
seconds or 7200 / second.


Now trying to model this in Rebol, i used R3 on a newer machine (i7 
/ 6gb ram) with a block of integers from 1 - 120,000

PICK is blazing:  10, 000 picks in .011 seconds
but with SELECT it's 10,000 GETS in 2.23 seconds


My question is..  is there a faster way in Rebol to select a value 
from a key?

did you try using a map?

that uses a hash, and should be MUCH faster for selects.

>> a: make map! []
== make map! [
]

>> a/test: true
== true

>> a
== make map! [
    test true
]

>> a/test
== true

>> a/test: none
== none

>> a
== make map! [
]

(back from core :)

some nice results with map!


>> length? n  ; n is a map containing random keys, and a 25 byte 
string value
== 2000000


loadit 1000000  ; loads in an additional 1m key value pairs (same 
as others, and returns execution time
== 0:00:9.27  


test3 1000000   ; test3 is a function that GETS the value of a particular 
key 1M times, returns the last iteration's value (!string),  returns 
execution time
this is a bit of a string
0:00:01.616

That is blazing, nearly 10 times faster than Redis

wrote the data of that example to a text file.. 117mb

If you are serving multiple virtual sites and using stunnel, can 
you have a certificate for each virtual domain?

AFAIK, a certificate is only valid for one FQDN (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fully_qualified_domain_name).

Terry: map! uses a hash map, you would have similar results using 
hash! in R2. A hash map is as far from a NoSQL database as, IMHO, 
a NoSQL database is from a RDBMS ;-).

A hash map is far from a NoSQL DB.. unless you're magic. I have a 
method that's working fine, now looking for the fastest key/value 
datastore i can find that's easy to work with.

<rant>One thing Cheyenne (and Rebol) needs to do is grow up, and 
lose Altme as the primary source of communication</rant>


AltMe is convenient because almost all Cheyenne users come here for 
realtime chatting, but I agree on your comment. Adding a web forum 
to the Cheyenne web site would be a good thing.

Nodejs: I'm not sure if JS in V8 executes much faster than R2, I 
guess that V8's JIT would give it a significant raw speed advantage 
other Cheyenne. On the scalability side, Nodejs will scale much better 
than Cheyenne for a high number of concurrent connections, just because 
it can use polling and kernel queues instead of the non-scalable 
select( ) used in WAIT by REBOL. This is an important aspect if long 
lasting connections are used.

But for a hundred of concurrent connections, I'm not sure that it 
would matter that much, both JS and REBOL have their own internals 
overheads, so I guess that the select( ) bottleneck would really 
start to show up when reaching several thousands concurrent connections 
(cf the "C10k problem").

Kaj: "not exists? incoming-dir/:out" => thanks, that was a nasty 
one! I've commited your fix in svn.

Kaj: "Cheyenne doesn't seem to load its MIME definitions from the 
standard location on Unix systems, %/etc/mime.types, loading an internal 
list %misc/mime.types instead"


Yes, it was done that way to ensure a common base of mime-types across 
all OSes. Anyway, I have in my todo list an entry for such a feature. 
I'm not yet sure if it should be by default, or controled by an explicit 
option.

Kaj: "From earlier messages here, it was my understanding that Cheyenne 
on Linux can run its UniServe taskmaster processes under a non-root 
user account by enabling 'userdir in the modules and 'user and 'group 
in the globals. However, when I do that, all of Cheyenne is still 
running as root. The designated user and group exist. What else do 
I need to do?"


It was working last time I've checked. What Cheyenne version are 
you using? Have you remove all the log files generated by Cheyenne 
that are own by root before testing? Did you tried with other combinations 
of user and group?

Terry: short anwser: yes and no. Long answer: you should be more 
precise in your question. I guess that you're asking if a *single* 
Cheyenne instance can handle 10k concurrent connections on long lasting 
communications (HTTP keepalive or web sockets), the answer is : I 
don't know, I never tested that case. My guess is that if all clients 
are not sending requests simultaneously, Cheyenne should be able 
to handle it, but with a probably significant latency in the responses. 
For a real world web site, when dealing with short lasting requests, 
having a continuous load of 10k connections would mean that you're 
having a few million hits per hour making your web site one of the 
top 50 sites in the world, giving you enough money to invest in a 
huge cluster of servers to nicely handle the load with dozens of 
Cheyenne's instances ;-).

has anyone tried putting a webcache like Varnish in front of Cheyenne?

Terry, why don't you add Cheyenne to that Wikipedia page? A project 
is not supposed to comment on its own product on Wikipedia

Graham: a few links about your question: 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_Layer_Security#Support_for_name-based_virtual_servers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Server_Name_Indication

SNI is in stunnel's todo list: http://stunnel.mirt.net/?page=todo_sdf

It also says that NginX supports it, so that may be a better option 
than STunnel

Anyone got some quick instructions on how to use Nginx as a proxy 
for Cheyenne?

I use nginx as a frontend server and cheyenne as a backend where 
Cheyenne ca cretate static pages served by nginx... My motto for 
thic combo is: where west meets east as its American-Russian connection:)

Oldes: would it help if X-Real-IP header was used by Cheyenne to 
store the real client IP in HTTP logs? I was thinking about addind 
an option to tell Cheyenne that a HTTP header is carrying the real 
IP.

I get an "confirm" error from a RSP page that tries to delete a local 
file. How can I do this?

I start cheyenne as root (not recommended I know but...). So this 
shouldn't be a problem.

I found a series of problems due to which switching to a non-root 
user and group doesn't work

This makes Cheyenne run with a primitive configuration without an 
advanced system interface

Trying with View only works when the window environment is started, 
even when X11 is installed on a machine, so this is game over for 
headless servers

At least it can be tested with X11 running. Then I find that Cheyenne 
searches for the GNU C library in several places, but not in the 
place where Syllable Server has it. Here's a patch to misc/unix.r 
that fixes this for both Syllable and GoboLinux (the new version 
that's currently in development):

After that I found several more problems that make user switching 
unusable. Eventually I concluded that a rewrite of mod-userdir is 
necessary. I'm working on that and will post a patch after testing

The biggest problem was that it was switching the user and then the 
group - but after switching the user away from root, you have just 
given away your right to switch your group. So this never worked, 
and with the processes still having the group root, they could still 
access almost everything on a system, so there was hardly improved 
security

IDs that you specified were looked up in the user file - also if 
you specified the group. Although in most cases on most systems, 
user names have a matching group name with the same number, this 
is clearly wrong

Specifying just the user already looked up the group number of the 
user, but this was not used for the group setting. As said above, 
it's not very meaningful to only change the user ID away from root, 
so now specifying only a user changes both the user ID and the group 
ID to the IDs corresponding to the user

I'm not sure how meaningful it is to also specify a separate group 
(different from the group of the user), but if you do it should be 
looked up in the group file instead of the users file, so now it 
does that

The users and groups files are line oriented, but they were searched 
as a whole with PARSE. This can easily go wrong, for example if the 
name appears elsewhere in the file, for example in the comment field. 
They're now searched line by line

If you specify a number for the user ID, it is not used for setting 
the group, because it is not known if those numbers correspond

In general, the contained functions are quite a bit more flexible 
now

Well, I never thought I would be hacking a web server, so this is 
pretty cool, and Cheyenne makes it very easy :-)

Seems you've solved a lot of issues there.