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Graham - ok I'm seeding it... maybe a bit late. :-)

I'll take that as a xompliment, Reichart.

In a half-hour when I can cancel another seed, it'll jump more :)

i can only seed three at a time, so just let me know what you are 
downloading then :)

I will have to dig-up a bit in past messages. There is an "easy" 
way of how to use FF plug-in via some wrapper for IE ...

do you want me to do a checksum?

OK ... I have a different checksum .... (I downloaded this with Azurius) 
... I will try http later tonight

I'm off to do a shoot for the next few days, but I think I will be 
sitting on a set all day, so I will try to clean up and crop the 
600 photos I took.

is there a link for greg ii?

I tried to upload some photos to the DevCon page, but the Rebol tool 
told me that it failed due to a too long posting. Photos are about 
4,5 MB, not larger than 5, is this really too much as the already 
uploaded photos are also around 3+ MB (at least some) ?

Then I got also 3 quicktimes from the QA round after the devcon before 
the banquet, question is whether somebody is interested in them, 
so they might be uploaded somewhere as well. Just to note, that they're 
not especially good (just from my digital camera) and don't contain 
directly a lot of footage to be able to understand what has been 
talked about. More or less my girlfriend taking some videos from 
the people. ?!

can you reduce them a bit? otherwise i'll ask carl if the limit can 
be raised.

I try to reduce them a bit first.

ok I'm uploading now a few photos, all smaller than 4 mb

oh I'm so sick of being stuck on a 56k modem... :-)

Henrik: when they are all done, I can burn a cd and send to you ?

(hmm, the crontab to make photo thumbnails is not wroking, i'll have 
a look at it later on. in the meantime i'm going to update the page 
manually.)

hmm... the timer is a bit distracting. (watching the Gabriele video 
now :-))

I'm watching the Gregg's Dialect  presentation his introduction was 
really on the beam and he is a great speaker.

Cyphre - in your archive, there is a bug in window.r - there is win1: 
word used, while there should be only win: .... Gabriele - maybe 
you could fix it?

there is also imo a bug in Face skeleton slide - there is incorrect 
closing bracket ...

Gabriele:I am dling the Barons and Ashley but when i try to dl Roberts 
I get:error(10:14am) couldn't listen-(10048,addressalready in use') 
  I know you said only 3 at a time but I am only dling 2 ?

well we have a meber in China right now plus New Zealand,England,Canada,Scotland,Poland,Russia?

chris had an app where one could check a map with all the nationalities. 
any idea where to get it ?

Luca, yes, I saw Gregg in person at the Devcon2004 and he's a great 
speaker (he's also a stag actor, so likely helps here).  He also 
really knows what he's talking about when it comes to languages. 
 I've borrowed his expertise to help defend the merits of Rebol to 
some developer friends who just didn't get it - more like, they wouldn't 
listen to reason.  Gregg would make a great evangilist for RT.

Is there a way to download all pictures at once?

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/Visitto Rome and Milan.mp4.torrent


Note: this is an experiment; encoded with avidemux on linux and converted 
from avi to mp4 with VLC. (iMovie wasn't producing a good quality 
result) play with VLC. (BitTorrent download - HTTP download available 
as soon as i finish uploading)

I don't know the details yet, but my understanding is that BEER does 
a lot more in terms of transport then LNS. LNS needs a transport 
and BEER is much more advanced than basic Internet protocols

But LNS is not a transport protocol

petr: LNS does not need to support "certificates" as it does not 
need SSL. actually, i don't see any reason for having SSL as a transport 
for LNS as it is already encrypted.

And for LNS you need a transport, and this could be BEER

Last public announcement said live by may-2005:
http://www.rebol.com/news/rt5330.html
Perhaps you could ask via the RT Q&A

As for lns development, I did a small lns emulation a while back 
based on published info. I found writing a service was easy, I think 
Gabriele demonstrated this well. I concluded that lns was a great 
idea, but there will be a learning curve of course. Reqesting the 
service from the client is a one-liner, but that is only the beginning 
of the story. Aside from the careful thought required in designing 
a service API, it will be interesting to see how people structure 
their client code because I think that is where the complexity of 
lns development could be from a programming point of view (e.g dealing 
with the service response).  Of course it depends on the application.

It is all about - you can do it with rebol, or you can't. Talk "enablers" 
once again. Do you think that ppl look at tools to actually produce 
some support first, or they simply want to use it for the task given. 
One example - someone wants to use PostGress for e.g. Now he is looking 
for some tool, eventually likes rebol. There is a BIG difference 
if such person is about to just do %postgress-driver.r and connect 
and use it, or to actually spend months producing the driver on his/her 
own.

We are one of the first companies here in CZ, who try to fully solve 
electronic invoicing. In order to not need a paper, our law (and 
many EU countries too), simply require usage of certificates. It 
has nothing to do with how secure your transfer is. Simply once financial 
institute clerk comes to our company, he wants to see original invoices. 
And so far, it is paper. And if it is e.g. PDF, it has to be signed, 
as the person will ask - how can I be sure, it comes from company 
XY? He can - he can check e-signature and time-stamps signatures 
and he can be sure, that 1) the invoice comes from company (identity) 
XY and that it was not later modified, or the e-signatures would 
be invalid ...

maybe I should post my request in RT Q&A group ...

about "I don't want to write it myself" - we're lucky that some of 
us don't think like that (i.e. nenad's mysql:// and so on...) :-) 
but anyway, if you need it, and are even ready to pay for it, i'm 
quite sure that you'll be able to find a rebol developer willing 
to do it for you... I can't speak for RT so I can't tell you if we 
are gonna do it or not; i think REBOL's SSL implementation needs 
this functionality, but there are so many things in the todo list...

Pekr: re Electronic Invoicing. We have a pretty simple system here 
call BPAY / View which allows invoices to appear inside the client 
internet banking. Supported by most of our large banks and used by 
councils, utility companies to do invoicing. A client just signs 
up to receive invoices in electronic format. http://www.bpay.com.au/viewbills/viewbills_qa.asp#qa151.

i cant see peers to. hmm, have a firewall on. you too?

Does it work now? played a bit with options, now someone is downloading.

Colin: the audio is standard MPEG4 audio (aka AAC), but it looks 
like VLC does not like it in this case (64kbps mono). I've been told 
that some versions of VLC do play it, so maybe it's just a bug.

RE: 2005 Devcon...Yeah, but did they have a guy dancing in a fish 
suit?

at least they didn't have a bald guy in a sweaty shirt dancing... 
:-) or throwing chairs!

Geomol said he was glad I did not send him a costume...0-o-o<

Here is a (hopefully complete) list of links to all the speakers 
and video presentations:

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/carl.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/gregg.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/gabriele.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/cyphre.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/maarten.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/jaime.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/reichart.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/ashley.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/john.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/ladislav.html
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/robert.html

Torrents


http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/Visitto Rome and Milan.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/Discussionsand Banquet.mp4.torrent


http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/CarlSassenrath.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/GreggIrwin - Logo.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/GreggIrwin - Dialects.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/GabrieleSantilli.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/RichardSmolak.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/MaartenKoopmans.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/JaimeVargas.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/BaronR.K. von Wolfshield.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/AshleyTruter.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/JohnNiclasen.mp4.torrent

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/RobertMuench.mp4.torrent

HTTP links


http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/CarlSassenrath.mp4

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/GreggIrwin - Logo.mp4

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/GreggIrwin - Dialects.mp4

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/GabrieleSantilli.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/RichardSmolak.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/cyphre-slides.zip

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/MaartenKoopmans.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/JaimeVargas.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/beer-slides.pdf

http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/BaronR.K. von Wolfshield.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/AshleyTruter.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/JohnNiclasen.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/john-slides.zip
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/videos/RobertMuench.mp4
http://www.colellachiara.com/devcon05/Robert.pdf

(note: there are a few pdf and zip files under "HTTP links" which 
are not torrents.)

and so will Microsoft.  They don't stand a chance now, after watching 
several videos...

I appreciated being able to see the videos. Facial expressions and 
tone of speech convey a lot information. Generally, the presentations 
were interesting - providing good "food for thought". One item out 
of many, was Gregg's turtle metaphor - a great idea. Leaves you with 
a new way of looking at things, which is what is great about REBOL 
itself.  Good to see a varied set of participants there too.  "Devcon 
was cool?" - I think the coolest thing was an apparent gathering 
of momentum and intent going forward. Good stuff.

The occasional focus changes were due to a bad autofocus situation. 
Any aleged drunkenness on the part of the cameraman wouldn't have 
affected the picture :)

Brett, I also grokked Gregg's "turtle" hunting metaphor.  Already 
I have filled more than a page of inspirations from it.  Here is 
a sampling of  my found design patterns, mostly in REBOL which are 
powerful "turtles" which are concrete examples of what Gregg said:


1. View console where a user can type VID/View lines, and hit return 
to see what they do.

2. Using print statements to the console from a View script to understand 
it (so easy to do protytping)

3. Parts of layout.r IDE with Nubs, and you generate scripts (which 
are human readible) from the GUI.
4. The source and help systems built-in to REBOL

5. Arexx for Inter-App-Messaging (I listened intently to Gab's Reb/Services 
talk saying "Arexx of the X-Internet")
6. awk file parsing. (I know Gregg wrote rawk.r a while back)

... "Turtle hunting" challenges us to develop more of these.

Gabriele, oh. Makes a difference!

It's a shame I can not watch the videos with my DVD player. I  just 
bought a cheap (40 euro) dvd player that plays zones 1/2 and MP4. 
I've copied the NerdTV MP4 interviews (see links) and have enjoyed 
quite a lot watching that on TV rather than the monitor ... but the 
devcon videos don't play (probably because of the MP4 profile and 
the audio not being MP3/WMA)

Yes, I thought about using transcode in linux. It's a shame all the 
variations don't make MP4 use as smooth as it could be. e.g. on Linux 
Fedora4 I could only get audio+video for your experimental encoding 
(trips to rome .. BTW, what is the band playing the background music 
?) . For the other files I could only get video but no audio so I 
had to check it in windows XP SP1 (where latest quicktime  and media 
player wouldn't play them (quicktime said incompatible profile) but 
an old VLC release played them fine)

yes, xvid and divx are a variation on the MPEG4 standard (created 
when MPEG4 was not yet approved as a standard IIRC)

btw - looking at Carl slides, there was a question of where to do 
Devcon next year? Were there any tips? Or will it be Czech Republic? 
:-)

And Jaime would surely prefer CZ, as we have the best beer here and 
Jaime likes Beer! (at least as a product/framework) :-)

We should put it to a vote.  I vote in Czech, although does not need 
to be Prague.

I work with a guy who is from the Czech Republic and his brother 
and friends built my house. They constantly played the "megaconcert" 
CD. And I mean constantly...: ^)

would be hard to stop my wife from forcing me go to a devcon in the 
netherlands

Kaj, we have a supplier here in Southern California.

wont touth that ... but I have found a local (but expensive) source 
for Wyberts  which I eat like candy

wait, there was a real Alitalia pilot; the first day he arrived directly 
from the airport with his uniform. his name is Paolo Marciante.

Is there a way to get all the pictures as a Zip?

And did I ever upload all my pics form the conf?  I have been so 
busy I don't remember.

OK.  Yes, I am still working on my own, and yes, I will upload a 
Zip for you soon.  Can I get a zip of yours?

Do I need to upload it as a tar.gz?

I have a LOT of pictures.  So will prob send you a zip.

However, it is commonly used as a way to pack things into one archive.

As Graham pointed out, I simply was going to use Zip as a quick way 
to package everything.  Since I was going to break stuff down into 
directories.

Historically we've had the eFish (Davis) and then Gabriel (Italy), 
I've heard some talk of Prague. I just throw that out to see if someone 
comes up with a place.

I would like to suggest another US location for next fall or postponing 
it to spring 2007.  One requirement is a coordinator to find a reasonable 
place to hold the conference.

Some cool US cities, Savannah, Georgia,  Fort Lauterdale, Florida, 
 San Francisco, California,  Sedona, Arizona (gives a chance to see 
Grand Canyon for international people) (there are others...) any 
feel for desired location?  (I am glad to help with coordination 
either lead or behind the scenes if someone else steps up to volunteer.)

I like the idea of a group of REBOLs going to Washington DC.

not sure I'd wear a REBOL t-shirt  while visiting the capitol hill. 
   hehe  specially since the O looks a bit like a target  ;-)

Do we have a winner?

time to make a devcon2006 group?

Fall is really nice in DC. Not very cold and a beautiful display 
of nature colors. But I bet the island of Maui will be 10 times more 
beautiful.

There are a couple of good groups here. You have  the telcos, the 
new comms companies, the aerospace and all the security firms.

if it's maui, i'll make sure to be there a week earlier and take 
a vacation ;) i don't think i'd have many more occasions to go to 
vacation to Maui hehe :)

G, we created a new group in your honor.

But there is going to be a price for this one liner. Either in load 
time, security, size, and others.

Agreed.  About there being a price, wherever it hides.

If I get my wish and you can parse ports in R3, that would deal with 
the major advantage that LOAD has over PARSE, that you can LOAD files 
and urls directly. PARSE on ports with a LOAD directive would be 
the best of both worlds. I only wonder how backtracking will be handled 
on direct ports.


I hope that you will be able to LOAD ports too, particularly LOAD/NEXT.

yes to all of the above, wrt backtracking, its not impossible, but 
its a hell of a complex algorythm.

pekr, did you look at the blog?  I filled it up with (too) many comments, 
brian had a very good insight in modifying one concept I proposed.

REBOL/Command for Linux includes AGG (without View/VID), so no dependencies 
on any X11 libs, can be a workaround while waiting for R3.

Oke ... now understand... That request I posted a few years ago... 
So that works in Rebol/Command... nice to know ...

so if you want to provide a spec for the task you use a block inside 
the arg block

all my scripts start with a rebol header.... do won't execute them 
otherwise :)

so you just write a wrapper task: func [header body] [make task! 
reduce [header body]]

btw - could scheme be seens as a "class" for port?

that was before I hated Microsoft, but I couldn't understand quite, 
why my old C64 had a faster Basic

I'm not an Amigan, though I do have one book on 3D graphics programming 
in Amiga BASIC, and I have a good friend who had an Amiga and a Video 
Toaster. I didn't know who Carl was until I found REBOL.

That's the same for me. I came to Rebol looking for an easy solution 
to a communication project.

I was just joking btw :-)  REBOL just attracts a lot of Amigans, 
on its own merits.  Most of these are FORMER amigans, who liked the 
simplicity of amiga's design.

My story is about the same as BrianH's. Really wanted an Amiga, read 
up on it a lot. By the time I could afford one (busboys don't make 
a lot of money) the Amiga was obviously done for.

I understand, that REBOL3 won't be 100% compatible with earlier versions, 
so some scripts will eventually crash. I also understand the reasons 
for this decision, the urge to get everything as 'right' as possible, 
that the language concept for REBOL is so inventing as it is, etc. 
But for larger projects, developers making libraries etc., this is 
not a good thing. Are there any plans around this problem for the 
future? Maybe compatibility modules is a possibility? Or will that 
be very hard to do, because it might lead to a mixture of old and 
new code?

A solution to the problem could be to make a kind of cross-compiler 
between versions of REBOL. Maybe that isn't possible in all situations 
with this avanced language, I'm not sure.

One of the things, I really don't like as a developer, is to get 
code to work again, which I've already tested and had running in 
an earlier version (of the language or OS or library or whatever). 
(A lot of this is going on, when developing for the Windows platform.)

Ideas are in the works to alleviate as much of this as possible. 
 Stay tuned.  It is not

a non-issue, and will be thought through.  Opinions, complaints, 
suggestions

appreciated.  I think the Libary Team forum is good for that, but 
so is this one, as well 
as Core.

Those I've seen. R3 looks interesting. Hopefully I can figure out 
how to download the streams, as my download manager's RTSP support 
seems to be more specific to RealPlayer streams. I can't hear them 
right now - I'm in a server room - so I must download them for later.