AltME groups: search

We're now on REBOL3 world.....Two crashes of REBOL.net, each need 
to create a new world and abandon the old one.
Not a great advert for the x-internet.
 What needs to happen to ensure we never need a REBOL4 world?

I custom build X Internet systems.  I can go 50-50 with you.

Altme ties in to the X clipboard rather than the Gnome/KDE clipboard., 
which leads to some embarrassment for quick pasters like me. I managed 
to paste the wrong link in the Links topic twice because I just assumed 
that C-v would paste whatever was in the clipboard.

I forgot that there are a couple of clipboards in X :-/

Hey, this may be something for you clipboarders ...

autocutsel

Synchronise the two copy/paste buffers mainly used by X applications
http://www.lepton.fr/tools/autocutsel/

I do not understand this:
>> x: to-set-word 'y
== y:
>> x 'z
== z
>> probe y
** Script Error: y has no value
** Near: probe y

can somebody explain or point me at some docs?

your trouble is, that the evaluation of X doesn't have the same effect 
as if you replace X by its value. The evaluation of X only yields 
a set-word instead of setting anything. If you really want to set 
a word 'y, then there are two ways:

set x 'z

do compose [(x) 'z]

Petr, for fault tolerance, something like:

   sort/compare ...... func [a b] [ attempt [return a/x < b/x] return 
   false]

Why return false?

It was a very quick attempt to ensure that the sort always returns 
true or false.
But which (as you say) depends on whether a/x or b/x is missing.
Maybe better is
func [a b] [
    attempt [return a/x < b/x]   ;; both exist
    attempt [a/x return true]    ;; only a/x exists
    attempt [b/x return false]    ;; only b/x exists
    return false]                          ;; neither exist


It''d be a lot faster (I guess) if you refactor to remove the attempt 
blocks -- use value?

func [a b] [attempt [return a/x < b/x]   ;; both exist

 return 0 ;; nothing can be said because at least one does not exist 
 so they are equilivant
]

in rebol you will need to load 3 files to declare SDM2Header_f1 SMD2Header_f3 
and SMD2Header_f3 with for both the stricly identical content tso 
your recoding 3 times or X times the same thing ...

to avoid to rewrite X time the same lind of code we just in the switch 
premaid a countainer adapter to the data we want to handle.

You are almost one step ahead of me there, Yeksoon.

The code is in place to make each of the banner statements clickable. 
That will take you to a page with an extended explanation.

Example: one of the soundbites might be "includes cross-platform 
assembler for 20x code speed-up". If clicked will take you to a paragraph 
on rebcode with links to more documentation.

But first, we need the 20 best soundbites :-)
Any offers?

Search [______________________] in  [x] Scripts  [  ] EMails [  ] 
Articles   ( _ Go! _)

i don't think my CSS is very good, I know Chris could make it 10x 
better. but until someone does a better one... i have something to 
use :)

OS X has a default palette of rather bright colors for highlighting 
to choose from, suggesting the text colors to be dark, so the text 
still can be read when selected.

Co-recursive types:
>> owed: func [x] [either paid? x [negate x][false]]

>> owed?: func [x] [either all [integer? x negative? x] [true] [false]]
>> paid: func [x] [either owed? x [negate x] [false]]

>> paid?: func [x] [either all [integer? x positive? x] [true] [false]]
>> a: 5
== 5
>> owed a
== -5
>> owed? a
== false
>> owed? b: owed 5
== true
>> a: paid b
== 5
>> paid? a
== true
>> paid? paid -5

In last View version (1.3.x) and last Core, there is a 'new-line 
function to format a block in lines. I think it does not work on 
hash! (just try), but you can use 'to-block on your hash! to be able 
to use it.

That is useful to know.  So you are saying that one our of X times 
logging in, it will suddenly sync?

Sorry, let me restate............"one out of X times."

I was more thinking that adjusting it upward would force AltME to 
read back on X number of messages

it is overall interesting issue - to get rebol running on various 
platforms in a way so it adheres to particular platform habits .... 
OS-X, WinCE being reported as Rebol feeling kind of hostile there 
...

Kaj, why AGG nor Cairo were found as insufficient for Syllable purposes? 
IIRC it is Cairo, which will be used by Mozilla platform or even 
OS-X to render, no?

you guys are terrific :-) In current days, when only Windows and 
Linux are considered as having chance to succeed, well, I forgot 
OS-X of course :-)

No printer support yet. We're planning to port and integrate CUPS 
in the 0.6.x series, which we will start soon. Basic printer support 
will probably happen in the coming year

We're now officially out of the 0.5.x series, which were meant to 
update our base technology and were thus fairly chaotic. We now have 
a good development platform for the innovations that we have been 
planning

No problems with slackware 10.x

Is there any specific need to make View 1.3.50 running under Linux:
- It runs right while clicking the icon
- it fails to run from a terminal:
	./rebol
	** User Error: REBOL: Cannot connect to X server
	** Near: size-text self

I mean - if your server does not have X-Win installed, then you have 
to use Core

Damn Small Linux 2.0 released..  http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/index.html


Damn Small is small enough and smart enough to do the following things:


    * Boot from a business card CD as a live linux distribution (LiveCD)
    * Boot from a USB pen drive

    * Boot from within a host operating system (that's right, it can 
    run *inside* Windows)

    * Run very nicely from an IDE Compact Flash drive via a method we 
    call "frugal install"

    * Transform into a Debian OS with a traditional hard drive install
    * Run light enough to power a 486DX with 16MB of Ram

    * Run fully in RAM with as little as 128MB (you will be amazed at 
    how fast your computer can be!)

    * Modularly grow -- DSL is highly extendable without the need to 
    customize

Volker is suggesting this:

escape-metachars: func["escape metachars" s][
 replace/all s "'" "''"
 rejoin ["'" s "'"]
]

browse: func[url]compose/deep[

call rejoin ["screen -X screen -- " (view-root/bin/browser.sh) " 
" escape-metachars url]
]

The libc bits on an up-to-date "Red Hat Enterprise Linux WS (v. 3 
for x86)"  
 


-rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root      1144368 Mar 24  2004 libstdc++-2-libc6.1-1-2.9.0.so

-rw-r--r--    1 root     root       426620 Mar 24  2004 libstdc++-3-libc6.2-2-2.10.0.a

-r-xr-xr-x    1 root     root       408440 Mar 24  2004 libstdc++-3-libc6.2-2-2.10.0.so

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           30 Dec 22  2004 libstdc++-libc6.1-1.so.2 
-> libstdc++-2-libc6.1-1-2.9.0.so

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           30 Dec 22  2004 libstdc++-libc6.2-2.a.3 
-> libstdc++-3-libc6.2-2-2.10.0.a

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           31 Dec 22  2004 libstdc++-libc6.2-2.so.3 
-> libstdc++-3-libc6.2-2-2.10.0.so

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           20 Dec 22  2004 libstdc++.so.2.7.2 
-> libstdc++.so.2.7.2.8

-rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root      1025339 Mar 24  2004 libstdc++.so.2.7.2.8

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           18 Dec 22  2004 libstdc++.so.2.8 
-> libstdc++.so.2.8.0

-rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root       375773 Mar 24  2004 libstdc++.so.2.8.0

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           22 Dec 22  2004 libstdc++.so.2.9 
-> libstdc++.so.2.9.dummy

-rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root         5428 Mar 24  2004 libstdc++.so.2.9.dummy

lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root           18 Sep 29 18:51 libstdc++.so.5 
-> libstdc++.so.5.0.3

-rwxr-xr-x    1 root     root       709456 Jul 19  2005 libstdc++.so.5.0.3

no, I don't have x-windows powered linux here ... I was just curious, 
as there were some features not supported iirc? but maybe I am confused 
because of os-x version ... well, agg does not use fonts, but dunno 
if true or not ...

nice .... what about OS-X - does it use FreeType too? Windows uses 
TrueType, right?

/view wants to connect to x and errors out without. and cgi usually 
has no DISPLAY set (or no X on server at all).

do you have X on your server? (the one which you use later)

would be rebcmdview then with graphics. i am curious if that runs 
without x with faces.

or try it from one of the system-consoles, utside x.

if x but not r you can access files in it but not list its contents

With Apache 2.x (normal CGI), we have: make object! [ 
	server-software: "Apache/2.0.54 (Fedora)" 
	server-name: "localhost" 
	gateway-interface: "CGI/1.1" 
	server-protocol: "HTTP/1.1" 
	server-port: "80" 
	request-method: "GET" 
	path-info: "/sample01.rhtml" 
	path-translated: "/var/www/html/sample01.rhtml" 
	script-name: "/cgi-bin/magic.cgi" 
	query-string: "" 
	remote-host: none 
	remote-addr: "127.0.0.1" 
	auth-type: none 
	remote-user: none 
	remote-ident: none 
	Content-Type: none 
	content-length: none 
	other-headers: [
		"HTTP_HOST" "localhost" 

  "HTTP_USER_AGENT" {Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.10) 
  Gecko/20050720 Fedora/1.0.6-1.1.fc4 Firefox/1.0.6} 

  "HTTP_ACCEPT" {text/xml,application/xml,application/xhtml+xml,text/html;q=0.9,text/plain;q=0.8,image/png,*/*;q=0.5} 
		"HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE" "en-us,en;q=0.5" 
		"HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING" "gzip,deflate" 
		"HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET" "ISO-8859-1,utf-8;q=0.7,*;q=0.7" 
		"HTTP_KEEP_ALIVE" "300" 
		"HTTP_CONNECTION" "keep-alive" 
		"HTTP_COOKIE" "PHPSESSID=7f84fd7766f23e1462fed550ecbbfda4"
	] 
]

Can anyone help me to configure apache 2.0.x and rebol for FastCGI 
under Windows XP?

Hello everyone..
I have a CGI problem/question.


I have a Win-apache-rebol server that isn't propagting the cgi info 
properly..
Upon posting.. the query-string is empty.
I am not sure what I am missing..

Details:

page1.rcgi
========================
#!c:\rebol\rebol.exe -cs
rebol []
print "content-type: text/html^/"
print "<html><body>"
print "  <form action='page2.rcgi' method='POST'>"

print "    <input type='text' name='var01' size='16' value='test'>"
print "    <input type='submit' name='go' value='Lookup'>"
print "  </form>"
print "</body></html>"


page2.rcgi
========================
#!c:\rebol\rebol.exe -cs
REBOL [ ]
print "content-type: text/html^/"
print "<html><body>"
print mold system/options/cgi
print "<hr>"
print "</body></html>"



if I .. ( decode-cgi system/options/cgi/query-string ), my vars are 
all undefined.

Also, looking at the 'print mold system/options/cgi' shows   query-string=""

if I change page1 form-action to ... "action='page2.rcgi?x=123"

then the query-string on page2 gets populated with x=123 and the 
value 123 gets assigned to 'x'
when I 'decode-cgi'.

However, my form fields NEVER get populated.
Does anyone have any advice?

John.

-rwxrwxr-x  1 cod-okna cod-okna   1504 Dec  5 22:24 pokus.cgi
-rwxrwxr-x  1 cod-okna cod-okna    284 Jan  3  2004 pokus.r
-rwxrwxr-x  1 cod-okna cod-okna 366148 Dec  5 11:26 rebol

it all depends, if such machine has X-Windows installed, or not. 
Mine has not IIRC ....

first guess view may not work without X installed (does not on solaris) 
and there is no good reason to run X on a web server ... and then 
there are all those fiddley fonts

and if you do have X installed the cgi script is likely not run  
from a graphicly aware shell so there may be virtual frame buffers 
involved

I haven't used rebol much on linux, yet, but the error sounds suspiciously 
like the common mistake of running rebol without X running, as Tom 
said. The linux server you are uploading rebview to may very well 
*not* be running X.  If that is the case, you will have to settle 
with Rebol/Core only.  Do you really need View features ?  I know 
some people found that they missed some image manipulation functions 
from Rebol/View that are not available in Rebol/Core.

Do you have a linux box at home to play with ? You could try install 
Rebol/View on it without X running and see what error you get...

size-text: xwindows is client/server. the x-server , that is your 
local computer, which offers to aplications to display things to 
you. And it has some important informations locally, especially the 
fonts (and can cache images and such).

/view needs access to the fonts and so access to a running x-server. 
the x-libs are only an interface to connect to the server. (The xserver-libs 
could be used directly, but well, /view does not do that. Seems to 
be tricky.)
A incomplete sketch how to do it, with no attention to security:

So with /view you need a running x-server, one way to do that  headless 
is vnc.  Can also run on another machine. 

Then you need to tell  rebol where it is, there is an env-var $DISPLAY. 
Which must be set before rebol runs. Did not figure out how to configure 
that. Running a bash-script as cgi, set  $DISPLAY, call the real 
rebol-script should work. And there may be issues with authentification, 
x-windows does not like everyone to connect by default, or the other 
way around, its too easy to make it too open ("xhost + ip"). There 
are more secure ways, but looked more complicated and i never tried. 
All in all i would run such things on windows.

it don't know freebsd well enough to give you a good answer. however, 
usually, if libm.so.2 is missing but they have libm.so.x (eg libm.so.3 
or libm.so.4) then it is enough to have a ln -s libm.so.x libm.so.2 
to make rebol work. same for any other missing libraries. this does 
not work always but works in most cases.

I played with Oldes script a bit, didn't get far. I think there's 
no other option than follow Graham's advice and delve in the http 
scheme. I had hoped to find something in the script archive, oh well... 
I saw that even in the Ruby and Python community there's some confusion 
on how to achieve multipart form submissions with CGI. (Python default 
http library also uses  "application/x-www-form-urlencoded" and not 
""multipart/form-data", but there's a library called HTTPFileUploader 
that does the job). Last time I tried to hack the http scheme I wasn't 
so succesful. This time, if I need help, I'll ask for help.

No, before the webserver, so you scale transparantly to multiple 
webservers (in my scenario each webserver effectively is the load 
balancer for X FastCGI rebol processes; it's how nginx and lighty 
work)

does IE 5.0 support 2.0 css? Because - I would not orientiate webdesign 
to NS 4.x or IE 4.x anymore - ppl should adapt, and if IE 4.x runs 
on such machine (Win95), so can Opera or Firefox ...

another question - if we want to consider IE 5.x and above, Mozilla/FF/NS, 
Opera 6. and above, are we ok with xhtml or should we stick with 
HTML 4.x transitional, or?

It's also similar to the way I create styles for VID projects too. 
 I use Xara X and PPaint far more than Photoshop though -- Photoshop 
isn't imo the best tool for the job.

for example, the pattern [any attrib "x"] would match any tag with 
the attribute "attrib" with value "x"

something like this?

As of <today>, it needs at least beta x (windows http://*), this 
and other betas are here: http://www.rebol.net/builds/

; Something like this, semantically at least, and would need adjustment 
based on the actuall block structure
get-element-by-name: func [x n /local l t c] [
    worker: func [x p w] [
        if n = t: first x [
            l: insert l context [elem: x parent: p where: w]
        ]
        t: fourth x
        forall t [worker first t x t]
    ]
    l: make list! 0
    t: fourth x
    forall t [worker first t x t]
    head l
]

if we take MacOS X example we all know what is the gain for Apple 
but it is more blur to see what is the befefit that OpenBSD project 
writers retrieves of this experience. A part a spot light put uppon 
there project. But every a little serrious coder was yet knowing 
that freeBSD and OpenBSD were rock stable OS

The cause of the error above is a communication protocol change, 
the driver was made for 7.x. It would need a good upgrade.

I was compiling the math functions to C and the result was about 
5-10x faster (not optimalized), but I cannot find that code right 
now.

For example:



Find | Select | Pick | First | Second | Third | Forth | Fifth | and 
Sixth are all really the same command:


If you picture a master command with lots of settings (refinements) 
and even some conditional code (if refinement set, do x).

To give you an example.. this.. 
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>

<mx:Application xmlns:mx="http://www.adobe.com/2006/mxml"layout="absolute">

<mx:Panel title="My Application" width="200" height="300" x="0" y="0">

<mx:Label text="Welcome to Flex!" mouseDownEffect="WipeRight" height="45"/>


</mx:Panel>
	<mx:PopUpButton x="483" y="20" label="PopUpButton"/>
	<mx:Accordion x="441" y="50" width="200" height="200">
		<mx:Canvas label="Accordion Pane 1" width="100%" height="100%">
		</mx:Canvas>
		<mx:Canvas label="asdf" width="100%" height="100%">
		</mx:Canvas>
		<mx:Canvas label="asdf" width="100%" height="100%">
		</mx:Canvas>
		<mx:Canvas label="adsf" width="100%" height="100%">
		</mx:Canvas>
	</mx:Accordion>
	<mx:CheckBox x="441" y="258" label="Checkbox"/>
	<mx:DateChooser x="238.5" y="31"/>

</mx:Application>

Adobe AIR beta provides additional features to enhance operating 
system integration:

    * Background applications

    * System tray icon (Windows) / Dock bar bounce (Mac OS X) notification
    * Default windows menus
    * Z-order control for native windows
    * Bitmap drag-and-drop support
    * Customization of program folder entry
    * New Mac and Windows install location

flash is on zero browsers until installed...I've set up machines 
at work for guys in the firehouse to use. Every computer there gathers 
so much adware/spyware/viruses that I can never keep up cleaning 
them. I've had to re-install windows so many times and each time 
I have to re-install the latest flash player. I resorted to setting 
up puppy linux and running off a bootable cd..(with the typical complaints 
about it not being windows) Anyway...rebol plug-in is easire to download 
than flash so what's the bigdeal. I install active-x controls all 
the time when I find a site that interests me and needs the control.

Will: I'm guessing that you meant a version running with /core under 
OS X.

Will: When I tried to load the latest version of RWSF under Mac OS 
X it failed as it calls a Windows DLL.

(By request, relayed from rebcode group) Could you add an APPLY opcode 
to rebcode?

    apply: ["Apply function or path to arguments, save result" word! 
    word! | path! block!]

In rebcode:
    apply x f [arg1 arg2 ...]
Is equivalent to this in REBOL:
    x: do f arg1 arg2 ...


The advantage to doing function calls this way is that the arity 
of the opcode is fixed, even if the arity of the function called 
can't be known ahead of time. The value assigned to the function 
word could be either a function or a path, or for efficiency you 
could have a seperate opcode APPLYP for path values (I'd prefer just 
one opcode for generality but it's your call).

Q: What does the world on Nov-15-2005 look like?


A: Our main goal is to get REBOL into the hands of more users, not 
just programmers and techies.... by the millions over time.  By doing 
that, we create a market for not only handy free REBOL apps, but 
also for commercial apps and entire businesses that are related to 
REBOL.



Q: Given that  window transparency is OS specific, will there be 
a dialect that covers both Windows, Linux and 40+ other OS?  In other 
words, does RT plan on continued support of so many languages, or 
are we entering a new era of specific OS support?


A: Our plan is to make that a window option that is part of the face/options 
for a window.  If an OS does not support this mode, then the option 
will be ignored, but the application will still be fully functional.



Q: I hope it is still valid that cooperation with RT is possible. 
I mean - last few weeks I play with some Win32 functions (thanks 
to Gregg) and I would like we would have proper app behavior in multi-monitor/multi-desktop 
environments .... so I wonder if any SIGs will be created, some ppl 
will be invited to participate, comment etc., or if RT is gonna cook 
it all themselves?


A: Yes, there are many such special interest projects currently going 
on. (Most of them are occurring via private projects in AltME and 
IOS.)  These days 90% of REBOL changes are done in cooperation with 
the REBOL community.



Q: Hi .... with recent Rebcode releases, we can see that internally 
new Core is marked as 2.7 and View is marked as 1.4 Is it just working 
"title" or will those products be marked as that? And if so, can 
we know, what other changes will go for 1.4 View release target? 
Will there be any AGG fixes/additions (to support SVG RebGUI progress), 
or even VID changes? I still think, that VID is missing few fine 
styles as tab, group-box, better list as was introduced on IOS Developer's 
server, (eventually tree, menu), to allow novices to start using 
VID/View more productively. Any chance RT can tell us, what is the 
plan for 1.4 release?


A: Regarding 2.7 and 1.4 question: we change the revision numbers 
(the second number) whenever there is a major change in REBOL that 
may be unstable.  The /core 2.7 kernel (that is in /view 1.4 as well) 
adds new datatypes to REBOL, and they are the first datatypes added 
in several years, so we consider this to be a major change, and marked 
it that way.
Yes, we do plan to be making a few AGG fixes very soon.

Oh, and regarding VID: we plan to be making very big changes there. 
More to come soon.


Q: Could you add struct! support to /Core?

I keep on having situations that would be made much easier by struct! 
when I don't need libraries. For instance, conversions from external 
binary data encodings to internal REBOL values, say for file formats, 
network protocols and so on. Now rebcode has added other forms of 
strong typing like the type-specific opcodes and the vectors. Having 
structs with their constrained field types, their specific data layouts, 
would be a perfect match for the low level operations of rebcode. 
They would be helpful later when implementing your own data types 
as well.


A: On structs: yes, we will enable this feature on core, but it should 
only be used for lower level code.  Objects are more powerful.


Q: Could you add an APPLY opcode to rebcode?

    apply: ["Apply function or path to arguments, save result" word! 
    word! | path! block!]

In rebcode:
    apply x f [arg1 arg2 ...]
Is equivalent to this in REBOL:
    x: do f arg1 arg2 ...


The advantage to doing function calls this way is that the arity 
of the opcode is fixed, even if the arity of the function called 
can't be known ahead of time. The value assigned to the function 
word could be either a function or a path, or for efficiency you 
could have a seperate opcode APPLYP for path values (I'd prefer just 
one opcode for generality but it's your call).


A: I'm not sure what is meant by the path for it. You mean for refinements?
That may actually slow down the apply interface.

Some time ago I talked with Carl here on AltME and mentioned PhotoThreads. 
Carl wanted me to keep an eye on it. There is newer version now. 
What is PhotoThreads can be read here: http://www.sics.se/~adam/pt/about.html
.... maybe we are lucky enough to get concurency with Rebol 3.x family 
:-)

>> x: [a b c d]   path x 'c   x
== [a b c]

changes re technology, or just that platform changes, so e.g. OS-X 
gets priority etc.? :-)

one solution is:

>> f: rebcode [] [add.i x x]
>> f': func [obj] [bind second :f obj f obj]
>> probe f' context [x: 3]
make object! [
    x: 6
]

Is there any schedule for anything actually? Rebcode, rich-text, 
rif? All we know for past two months is OS-X is being worked on/updated, 
and some unconfirmed rumours of Rebol 3.0 being considered to be 
developed. Any other info?

Ms provide the Active X controls for this unsupported research prototype

I find it hard to believe that any new "pc" can be 2-3x faster than 
another.  What metric are they using??

Maybe their OSX runs 2-3x faster on Intel cpus ?

Pekr, "why I am looking into mini-itx stuff". I have been waiting 
for nano-ITX for the last two years ... and in that time Apple have 
released Mac mini and announced Mac mini for x86.


I've done the sums, even with the wholesale prices I can get on most 
of the PC components (Via board, laptop HDD, RAM, Case plus time/cost 
of assembly), and the current Mac mini still comes out cheaper and 
quieter even with all the Mac software pre-bundled.


If Apple can release the new Intel-based Mac mini at the same or 
better prices, with the same or better specs, then why would anyone 
wait for Via to get their act together when they can buy a cost-effective 
off-the-shelf solution today, even if it means ditching OS X for 
Linux or Windows?!

 even if it means ditching OS X for Linux or Windows?!

  - not understanding here.  You're saying that Mac hardware might 
  be cheaper then building it yourself.  And then you ditch OSX so 
  you can run windows/linux on the Mac ?

well - I have never used OS-X, but I am not scared - but - I need 
modern codecs - divx, xvid in codeck-pack or ffdshow, bsplayer ... 
just give me those sw on OS-x

I also fear - touching OS-X, as good unix based derivative, would 
mean no way back for me to crappy Windows, where still inserting 
the floppy may mean your OS is gonna block for few secs ;-)

pekr, of course all these things are already available for OSX and 
have been for a long time. One thing that kind of surprised me is 
how many apps surpass Windows equivalents in quality, simply because 
the underlying foundation with Cocoa is incredibly strong. You can 
tap into a lot of amazing functions and the OS itself can do things 
where Windows would need third party software to do the same.

For example, look at Jaime's presentation from the REBOL conference. 
It was done in Keynote which is a presentation program made by Apple 
which makes Powerpoint look like a silly joke. It uses full 3D hardware 
acceleration and can apply pixel shader effects to the presentation 
through Core Image. By having a very strong set of video functions 
as well, presentations can be exported to a lot of different videoformats 
from DV to H264 or MPEG4, etc. in any size or framerate. You can 
also convert parts of it to a PDF document or a bitmap image. All 
this is possible, because OSX does this in Cocoa and is available 
at the developer's fingertips. This is also what made apps like iMovie 
possible, because they integrate into OSX.


Often the wrong question to ask is "Does program X exist for OSX?", 
because the programs are different and often of much higher quality. 
A lot of programs don't even have Windows equivalents. The community 
reminds me a bit of what bedroom programmers did during the old days 
of the Amiga, when they used the hardware and made beautiful demos. 
There are a lot of small, free apps available that do 2-3 things.

Three problems with them:


1) The widget engine is a hefty 12MB or so download (for widgets 
that are nothing other than HTML+CSS+Javascript+Images bundled in 
a zip file with a magic extension)

2) The download/installation process tries repeatedly to high-jack 
your browser preferences

3) The widgets look pretty ordinary compared to the OS X dashboard 
equivalents (go here, http://www.apple.com/downloads/dashboard/and 
compare the respective dictionary/thesaurus offerings)

Maybe something for Rebol as well:


dsandler writes "Researchers at Rice University have just released 
version 0.7 

of FeedTree, a peer-to-peer system for distributing Web feeds faster. 
Instead of 

polling feeds independently, FeedTree users cooperate to share news 
updates 

using multicast in Pastry, a scalable p2p overlay network. FeedTree 
reduces the 

update delay for existing RSS and Atom feeds to a few minutes without 
putting 

extra stress on the webserver (anyone who's ever been temporarily 
banned by 

Slashdot's RSS feed knows this is a real concern). Feed publishers 
can also 

choose to push digitally signed updates for immediate, tamper-proof 
delivery to 

subscribers. The client software (download) runs on Linux, OS X, 
and Windows, 
and works with any desktop feed reader." 
 
http://rss.slashdot.org/Slashdot/slashdot?m=3816

the x-internet is encrypted now.

I agree with Maxim as well, there needs to be UI somewhere to stop 
automatic downloads.


With that said, is it possible to clean this whole thing up and reduce 
it to one place where you either have what you need or you don't.


Using Adobe Acrobat as an example, they have one plug-in interface.

When you download stuff, it asks you if you want any of the other 
modules Adobe has for you.  In fact a close friend of mine created 
one of those modules (Atmosphere), which is funny that Adobe's interface 
even asks if you want this, since almost no one know what Atmosphere 
is.


So a single consistent dialogue should pop up with something like 
this:

You have:

Rebol command 1.3 for OSX
Rebol view 3.0 for OSX

New modules that are available:    

[_] Rebol view 3.0 for OSX
[_] VID2 interface Alpha for OSX


[X] Always ask before downloading

[Skip] [Download all now]

as for browser preference, for me it is IE, FF, Opera, other ...., 
I can see Opera dominating embedded space (PDAs, cell-phones), but 
maybe it is because penetration of OS-X here is nearly non-existant 
... but as someone pointed out - whole world except MS uses Netscape 
API plug-in and even for IE, you can develop ActiveX, which wraps 
the same plug-in, so maybe RT would not have to develop separate 
versions .... otoh we are talking wrappers only anyway, the main 
part is View in .dll form ...

Henrik, do you mean x # of events per second?

Josh, thanks for explanation about the delayed events. What a pity 
you cannot improve this also in Rebol2.x version as this problem 
sheds bad light upon Rebol/View apps (which uses drag'n'drop and 
simmilar features).

No red x, but a window pops up which says: Show on face in closed 
window.

I like that ugly and different. Tells me i am not working inside 
the app. Because inside the app, if it asks me "Do you like [x] please?" 
i click yes, whatever [x] is. Its in a sandbox, no?

Scot: REBOL/Core 2.6x or View 1.3.x are ok for Cheyenne. Avoid the 
experimental async REBOL kernels.

Oldes: View can be a good choice for server is you need server-side 
dynamic image generation or manipulation. The drawback is for Unix 
servers, they'll require X libs to be installed.

Hope it gets faster to 1.0.x then the mysql driver ;-)

there are still stability issue on heavy traffic, at least on OS 
X

exactly, I can't fix 2.7 myself, but since RT is making updates and 
rebcode was part of the 2.X code branch... it obviously can be compiled 
back in.

and you can play amazon. when x is picked, offer y too.

One of my close friends and x-employees wrote most of the drivers 
for BeOS.

I just checked the code. I made it under Linux, and it gives an error 
regarding a "dirty?" variable with View 2.7 under OS X. I can get 
it running with 2.6.

There are 2 OpenGL implementations for REBOL already. One by Cyphre, 
that require REBOL/Command (I think), and mine requiring GLServer 
(compiled C program, only for OS X so far).