World: r3wp

James - yes, problems under W2K, both IE and Mozilla Suite. Two machines, 
one behind the proxy, second not. Exactly the same here - the black 
bar ....

Pekr, Ah, I'm not too crazy then. : )  Thanks.

Hi James, Pekr,


the html code is different for IE vs Mozilla plugins. I'm not sure 
wether the web-pages have already been updated accordingly. (Well, 
actually I'm rather sure they haven't ;-)

FYI: I have been reassigned to work on upcoming Win32 features for 
REBOL 3.0. Your feature requests, bug reports, and general feedback 
is still very important to us, but we won't be releasing a new version 
of the plugin for a while.

We didn't forget all the changes and new features we talked about 
[i.e. security, trusted scripts, etc.], but we're putting those on 
hold while we focus on REBOL 3.0 features.

what do win32 features for REBOL 3.0 mean? Anything specific? Rebol 
is meant being cross-platform, although many would like to see things 
like better systray, com interface etc. :-)

I wonder if it means that plug-in is nearly dead - how long will 
the hold take? Maybe few last-minute fixes for mozz/ff/IE would help? 
It does not work in W2K :-)

I'm not sure what I'm cleared to discuss.....we're working on improving 
REBOL's Win32 experience.

The IE plugin doesn't work in Win32?

Win2k?

experience

? Does it mean platform specific things, like integration with OS? 
The same goes for MAC? I think "experience", under Windows, is rather 
good ... but - good luck to your new venture - we are all looking 
towards R3 :-)

Yeah, at work, proxy or not, W2K - no go ...

Hmm. I'll look into that, but we won't have any fixes for a while. 
Sorry.

(Carl is out of the office and we can't release without him)

ok

I don't want to fragment this group, but one project I am working 
on now is the Console....so if you have any ideas for console improvements 
in R3.0 please let me know in private chat.

(Win32 Console to clarify)

how about a group for that? there are a few things I'd like to see.

Wish things that were started could be finished ...

but if there is many things started? :-)

this jumping around from one plan to another is very unsettling ...

we make plans based upon RT's announcements ...

Well, as for plug-in, it is a pity, as last release has few things 
broken, fixing which would allow others to proceed ...

How can anyone plan anything ??

According to the blog, now is the time Carl is supposed to be in 
France for several weeks? We will have to wait anyway ....

It destroys the inertia that was here .. people lose interest.

there are too few people working on the various parts

but it would be logical to finish R3 first and then focus on the 
other things afterwards. what's the use of the plugin if it needs 
to be reimplemented for R3?

because R3 is distant future

and plugin is now...

bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush

well, sort-of-now :-)

we don't know what bugs R3 will introduce

many of us will stick to R2 unti we see how stable R3 is ...

right, but it would be easier if there was someone other than JoshM 
to keep the plugin fire going.

Graham may be right, unless R3 shows sometimes in two months or so. 
It is already one month late anyway, blog is filled mainly with rhetoric 
questions, to which decision is never announced .... so it is kind 
of worrying ;-)

I need the plugin badly for some commercial projects and they can't 
go anywhere without a production ready plugin. But we all know that 
REBOL development tends to go in the "ohh... shiny" direction. :-)

we are comforted with the notion that everything will fall into place 
once R3 comes out.

hmm, I think Carl is responsible though, not Josh .....

but maybe Josh could beta-release here without Carl's permission? 
So no on the web, but here? I bet there is just few bugs remaining, 
which prevent from plug-in usage ...

JoshM, don't want to ruin anything, but you could tell Carl that 
there were objections to this shift :-)

it seems you guys had something in concrete planning for the plug-in, 
right?

I had something in mind that would be used by thousands of customers 
potentially. I've been waiting for almost two years to implement 
it. That has to be implemented by someone else in AJAX now.

hmm, that is bad ...

but maybe that is how RT works with community? :-)

it still does not seem to work - communication is lacking ... Carl 
isolated himself (although it is understandable, he wants to fully 
concentrate), but although Gabriele tries to be helpfull, RT QA channel 
does not work. I bet Carl did not know about your plans, so the fault 
is on both sides ...

it would just work a lot better if there were more people assigned 
to easier tasks and something that would be officially recognized. 
does RT themselves have to maintain docs and site? why do I have 
to wait 2 months to see a typo in a document fixed when I could do 
this myself?

that is kind of general communication problem, and Gabriele should 
discuss it with Carl once he is back. Carl announced he want more 
involvement of community, yet the channels are closed from RT's side 
.....

we are for example still lacking proper documentation for VID. there 
are still many secrets in it. A knowledgable person could write it, 
some one else could proof read it and make suggestions about documentation 
flow and Carl could comment on it and have the final say. But if 
I know Carl right, he's very hands-on, wants to do it himself. :-)

I talk about docs, because, at least I document my products...