World: r3wp

I know Maxim likes OpenGL too.

If he's so busy on 3D for R2, maybe he should jump to R3?

R3 is too buggy for him, but I think he has not considered himself 
getting a chance to fix those bugs. If he has a chance, maybe he'll 
change his mind.

Buggy?

I can't risk working 2 weeks and hitting an issue which can't be 
solved because its an unfinished part of the host.
 - Maxim on R3 View

cause its buggy, cause I've got no time for release 

surprises" nor can I use all of the several MB of code I already 
have which works in R2. going to R3 is a big endeavor for people 
like me who have a lot of code to convert." - Maxim

i'm interested too (cause i already made a partial svg converter 
for R3 ,see http://sites.google.com/site/rebolish/test-1)

But i'm afraid i will be disconnected from rebol stuffs during comming 
weeks.

I think simply he hasn't considered if he would ever be put in charge 
of View.

Although I know he has some very particular features he wants to 
see in DRAW.

Well, a "limited release" of the main host source is not entirely 
out of the question.  Meaning, released to a small group.

I don't want to release it to everyone yet, because it would consume 
all my time to deal with the feedback, changes, hacks, etc.

If it helps to get the host code done first and then get someone 
to work on graphics, maybe that's a better idea. R3 is making great 
progress in other areas, which we don't want grinding to a halt.

Well, my main goal is to get parallel development on it.  So, if 
things are needed on graphics for View, that can happen while work 
is done on other core items.

I think we should get a hold of Maxim and see what he says. If he 
gets free access to the candy store, he might change his mind. :-)

I'm sure he would really like the candy.

Cyphre told me that he is waiting for actual sources. So maybe giving 
him the latest host source would be a good start.

darn, I go away a few hours and Carl pops in.... basically offering 
what I've been dreaming for the last Decade!
  

I would really like to participate in the host code, right now, I'm 
basically giving myself a very in-depth course in applied 3D graphics 
and I won't lie in saying I'd rather do it R3 if I would be sure 
that I won't run into an unknown and be stuck.


my comment wrt R3 being buggy, is not a comment on the quality of 
R3 itself, but the fact that many core things still change quite 
often.  so code using R3, especially very hard to debug and complex 
code like 3d arithmetics can become a nightware with the slightest 
little change.

Just hang around online for the next 24 hours Max

Quicker to talk to Carl on r3 chat

true, I'll go there and see if there's more news for me.

Carl, I posted messages to you privately on R3 chat... in case you 
didn't see them.

From the sidelines, I hope this bears fruit Maxim (and Carl). Very 
cool.


One favour to ask.  Max, if you get hold of our low levels ... be 
gentle ... try and factor some of it down so the 2 dimensional 4 
digit brain types still have a chance to decode some of that whiz 
bang almost too far out of the box stuff I suspect you may have brewing. 
 :)

don't worry, I want stuff to be simple to USE... its the behind the 
scenes which is complex  ;-)

Carl: "Cyphre was in charge of all graphics. But, he vanished into 
the Qtask black hole a year ago." More precisely, you stopped updating 
the host code on CVS, and me and him stopped having the ability to 
do anything useful on that front in the little time we had available.

Carl: I have the same feedback from Cyphre - he was mainly waiting 
for the "Go" and synced sources ...

Carl: Couldn't  more agree with Gabriele here. If you update the 
Host codebase so it is possible to compile latest R3 builds...things 
can start move on again especially in the upcoming days.

Carl, listen to the chorus: Release some source, even if it is a 
limited release to the interested-and-qualified-helpers. You need 
help :(

I second BrianH's opinion - please release to the first limited group 
of Devs, to prevent possible initial chaos. As for me - I think that 
we CAN manage the situation, even if you would release it publicly. 
Not many ppl use R3 Chat do download sources nowadays. I think that 
if you set some coordinator or two, e.g. BrianH, Henrik, Maxim  - 
whoever who will accept the role, then we will be fine and even other 
ppl can study the code and try some things for themselves ...

Yes... I agree... it is my fault!

wow... carl and I here at the SAME time  ;-)

Hello Maxim. Wow.

every other time you've been here, I was off line for a one or two 
hour period... and everytime you're not here, I'm there during those 
hours... hehehe

BTW... I was looking at your timings... puzzled by FOR times, I ran 
it in A94:
>> dt [loop 800 [for i 1 1000 1 []]]
== 0:00:00.015

is it still a mezz in R3?

Pekr, so R3 Chat is difficult to get source code? You can't be serious.
>> 26
.../Mezzaines
>> get *
--- Note: wrote file: work/r3/mezzanines/mezz-banner.r
--- Note: wrote file: work/r3/mezzanines/mezz-control.r
--- Note: wrote file: work/r3/mezzanines/mezz-debug.r
...

Maxim: native.

ah... that's why  :-)

Anyhow... the blame for the Host is not on Cypre or anyone other 
than me.

BTW, I *always* tell new users... "do not use FOR" unless absolutely 
necessary.

you could just setup a simple svn for it... its really simple to 
setup, and we can all easily participate and share our stuff, even 
if working on the same files.

simple and svn cannot be used in the same sentence, if I recall correctly.

But the reason I use DevBase (R3 Chat) is because it has accept/deny 
recordkeeping.

cvs is hell, but svn is really simple, at least on windows it is.

for example, with tortoise, its integrated directly inside the file 
explorer  :-)

Well, anyway, that's not the blocking factor.

Yes, I have tortoise, but I don't use it much... because it's not 
that practical for work flow.

So, Maxim, what's your main Dev system, is it Win32?

So, here's a rough game plan...

yep.  I also have a mac-mini now, so can also do some test on that.

but my mac is  not setup for C coding ... (yet)