World: r3wp

If you're using Cheyenne just as a MTA, better strip it down to just 
UniServe + MTA service, and integrate %Uniserve/libs/email.r in your 
client app.

I also use it as a web server

for prefilling Acrobat forms ...

If a pdf is loaded into a browser .. it allows one to post the data 
in an acrobat form ... but if it is loaded into acrobat reader alone, 
then it can post, but it can't understand any html returned by the 
web server

Graham, are you using Cheyenne's embedded mode or you're just launching 
Cheyenne's binary?

You could pass a message to C via websockets and have C send it along 
for you.

I use websockets for passing javascript and JSON to a static page. 
 The pages start off with a single javascript function, then i use 
websockets to lazy load.


Here's  pseudo for an email client using Cy (shorting Cheyenne to 
Cy from C.. keep confusing myself)


- Start with a blank page with the websocket function. No HTML, No 
css.. link to Jquery only  .. this page is under 1k

- Send an initial message to Cy with the page name, Cy responds by 
pushing the necessary HTML (simple email form), CSS and JS (a single 
function to send back the form results to Cy) to the DOM

- User fills out form, and submits.. pushing an array (JSON, string.. 
whatever) with the message details to Cy
- Cy sends the message via rebol mail

... but then 


.. Cy polls the users pop mail acount on a regular basis, and upon 
finding a new message, sends <i> sends a javascript function</i> 
to the page, that gets EVAL 'd . This could do some animation in 
a canvas tag, push some message to the browser's chrome.. whatever.
 

All using the same tiny webpage. When you look at the source, you 
see 20 lines of code.

JQuery is optional, you can lazy load any library you need, whenever 
it's needed.. it's possible to mix and match based on the requirements.

Doc, re Sencha.. i found it pretty smooth on an iPhone, but slow, 
what did you mean? I/O or animations?

Tested on Android only, any action in Sencha demos seem slow (clicking 
buttons, sliding, animations) compared to native UI.

@Graham: you are using web sockets for a wierd job. The shortest 
explanaiton for web socket is: it is the way to trigger an event 
on the client side from the server side via already open tcp (http) 
connection. ofcourse that connection is full duplex, client and server 
both can send a utf8 encoded (currently no binary) string messages 
anytime.

Doc, yes ... launching Cheyenne binary.

The other possible advantage may be that the mta might communicate 
back to me if the mail send fails?  Otherwise i have to read that 
data somewhere?

You can query Cheyenne's MTA (through RSP scrip) for email sending 
job status.

Sure .. just wondering if it's easier to do thru web ports and if 
the server can notify me thru an open port when it succeeds or fails 
rather than me poll the server

I wonder if this is a way to ask Cheyenne to unload it self ... I 
presume 'quit does not work in RSP scripts

Notification thru websocket port: sure, you can have that, but you'll 
need: a ws client for REBOL, a websocket app and a RSP script for 
that (the websocket app will need a timer to trigger queries on a 
RSP script to get the email status or hack in local MTA data to get 
the info to avoid querying a RSP script).

Doc, check out this link

http://blog.sproutcore.com/post/531215199/introducing-sproutcore-touch

fyi html5 has a new file api.. 
http://dailyjs.com/2009/11/30/html5-file-api/

Since the File API is asynchronous, files could be loaded and processed 
in the background while the user does other things. This could also 
be useful for creating web applications that work offline.

File Api Demo (requires firefox)
http://html5demos.com/file-api

If you haven't yet, check out http://lesscss.org/

Or look here if you want to code in something other than Ruby, PHP 
or .NET: http://fadeyev.net/2010/06/19/lessjs-will-obsolete-css/

And it's supposed to be 40x faster too, since the processing is done 
client-side.

Yeah, was looking for the JS link (not on their main site?)

<i>This</i> is the kind of thing I'm talking about when I say "less 
language, more tools".
There's basically ZILCH of this sort of thing in Rebol.

I mean, if this doesn't have Rebol dialect written all over it, what 
does?

less.watch() is pretty cool

well remark allows you to do this on ther server... and you could 
cache it so its just processed once.

http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=rebol&word2=less.js

well, if you search each one individually, you don't get the same 
results....

also note that at some point,  the word "less" is used directly.... 
 so this skews the results a lot

hmm, true

However, I think any kind of implementation like this should tie 
in with Cheyenne.

LESS looks interesting in that it could be incorporated into the 
HTML dialect.

Maxim, the reason the client-side processing is faster is not because 
of processing overhead, it is because the resulting CSS code is much 
larger than the LESS source code, so it takes longer to transmit 
over a network connection.

ok, but client-side caching should mitigate this difference .

I expect that the rest of the speedup came from the fact that Ruby 
is much slower than optimized JS. Still, not having to use Ruby is 
its own reward :)

Doc, just an update regarding using the browser on the websocket 
host box closing as soon as the websocket connects.. seems to be 
a Google Chrome issue.. Safari 5 is working fine

scratch the word "using" in that last post.
Post posting.. a great time to proofread ;)

Terry, Chrome is working ok here with my ws applications, but I've 
noticed such issues while writing them, wasn't sure if it was caused 
by the browser or my code.

To keep Cheyenne on the html5 leading edge, you may want to add a 
"server-sent events" service as well.

http://dev.w3.org/html5/eventsource

uses a text/event-stream mime type

It's basically a one way websocket communication... server -> browser 
 . Not sure what the real advantage would be, perhaps less overhead?

Interesting...Do you know if current browsers supporting ws, implement 
the EventSource interface too?

I believe Safari 5 does

yeah

here's a nice little tool
http://html5test.com

The latest Chrome does as well.

FF needs to step up to the plate

Section 9 "Connectionless push and other features" in the W3 doc 
is interesting.