World: r3wp

I had no intention to go into Parse. My only note of Parse was, that 
it is the actually undergoing priority, and you can note the fact 
by looking into R3 Blog topics .....

...some people would love to make sure that there will be no more 
tunnels...

In fact - I am confused about what you actually want? What do you 
think Carl should work right now on?

Gabriele - if you find yourself in a tunnel (which is our situation), 
you first have to escape it ... which is what we try to do ...

Apart from that Shadwolf forgot, that it was not only Carl himself 
working on R3. It was also Ladislav, Cyphre, you (Gabriele), BrianH, 
although not all of you contributed at C level ...

ofcourse it is a priority to polish parse ... but the thing is only 
car can try new feature...  having opensource accessible to all mean 
alot of tries can be done and shown and that's better than the 1 
to  X  relation we have. Mainly and i'm not the only one to say it 
we propose alot of things but since we can't show them they are. 
what do i want is a rebol that evolve faster ... it's been 2 years 
since rebol 3  enhancement started we lost alot of time in futil 
consideration like how do we name that and how about changing the 
name of this ... and we skipped during a loooooooooong time the main 
topic ....

R3 initially was just a R2  version with UTF8  support ...

and then carl said ok lets redo it all and 2 years and around 100 
 alpha version havec been made and we are still in the process ... 
 Mainly why because it's the work of a single man... and that's all. 
If carl don't push the rebol car the car stop and that's all ... 
you see all the comments you can do or not will not have a real impact 
on how the car rebol progress or not.

Shadwolf - then please go and ask Carl privately about open-sourcing 
topic. It sounds like I am against it - I am not. I just don't think, 
in comparison to you, that open-sourcing it NOW would bring us R3 
any faster. Soon enough (which I ufff, repeat for so long) we get 
EXtensions and host code. I bet it comes in few months. Then ppl 
can start porting efforts and extending the language .... ask Maxim 
for his plans :-)

Shadwolf - R2 to R3 is not Python 2 to Python3. It is a complete 
architecture change ....

Shadwolf - I talked to Carl, and he wants go into beta Autumn 2009. 
I actually think it will be Winter 2009, but I would like beta to 
include all important Core stuff, including tasking ...

cyphre working on R3 actually ? Cyphre didn't loged to atme since 
july 27 how active is that ?  I don't see many topic poped around 
at same time i see 1 main topic wroked and the related things worked 
at same time that's all. 

Complete architecture change .... hum ? but that's came along the 
flow my brother it wasn't a from the begining statement.

Cyphre is not working on R3 AFAIK.

I am glad that R3 was main rewrite of the REBOL. R3 starts to shape-up 
nicely. It is REBOL we should get from the very beginning in 1997 
though :-)

did i said R3 wasn't good ? i like many features in it but the progressing 
is slow that's all and repose entierely on carl...

well, the ports system has been done for over a year and is documented, 
but where are the protocols?

but yes I would say R2 lasted too long ... carl was glued in endlessly 
bug correction and few where the real improvements... the major addition 
in R2  was the AGG/draw dialect which since then have not evolved 
a bit... look at the number of tickets in old rambo. So yes starting 
with a ew base and bring alot of enhancement was a certain thing 
the problem is along the process we lost alot of people mainly interrested 
in rebol but not seeing it evolving fast anough and that how do you 
solve it ?

Henrik - we are bunch of lazy and uncapable lamers :-D

I would like to know, if some good C coder having experience with 
cooperative development could tell us, how much faster would R3 be 
developed, if more Core ppl would be involved. You know things like 
coding style, etc. I wonder if it is even possible that multiple 
coders work on such kind of project, like language kernel? There 
must be high standards, no?

yeah... but we assume it :P or at least i assume my lazyness and 
my stupidity but in other hands most of things I done with rebol 
where totally unexpected things .. and  once again every time i faced 
limitations that forbided me to push them till the end and release 
and maintain a product more than a demo ...

Shadwolf - we do wish, and we do hope for those ppl to return. We 
also hope to attract many new ppl.

Shadwolf - what imo Henrik tried to point out is, that R3 networking 
seems to be kind of solid for 1-2 years, yet noone picked-up and 
rewrote networking protocols - and that layer is of cource open-sourced 
...

pekr i think maybe if in those last 8 years of rebol if i had from 
the begining access to the code i could solve some of the limitation 
or organise myself  with other  people in the community to bypass 
the limitation and enhance at the same time rebol VM  you see that 
is the dynamic i want to see ... and that is the dynamic that only 
 opensource open access can bring...

pekr networking? you mean the remplacement of ipv4  by ipV6 ?

Shadwolf - you might be right with the community project organisation 
you mentioned ...

Pekr ... opensourced sorry but i don't have access to it i need to 
ask carl and  then it's up to carl to grant me the codes or not and 
as i'm an idiot and everyone knows it that's not going to happend

as for networking - no, what I had in mind is networking schemes 
- we do have only http 1.1, no proxy, no smtp, no pop3, no ftp, etc

i think steeve had maid some suggestion on the topic but noone listen 
to him ... so this means the source code are not as easy to put their 
hands on them as you say  pekr..  and i'm pretty sure if steeve could 
put his hands on that topic the result would be fun ..;

OK, let's be sure that open-sourcing REBOL is one of the questions/topic 
to be covered by Devcon 2010 Prague (if it happens) :-)

What do you mean? The code of schemes? Those are REBOL level mezzanines, 
hence free from the very beginning ...

pekr maybe people are waiting for things like threading  or other 
low level core stuff to start working on protocols.

there shouldn't be any need for that.

or maybe that's so easy to do that doesn"t interrest anyone to do 
them ...

There is some chance that after the Parse enhancements, BrianH overhauls 
Scheme dialect and will start work on protocols ...

man you are talking to me about things i don't undersand ...

for me networking starts and stops with read htttp://www.mysite.org/mydocument.html 
...

if i need more i copy past from people more clever than me other 
jobs :P

http://www.softwaredeveloper.com/features/ghosts-in-machine-071207/

BAM ...

ldci pointed that link ...


What do "Livin La Vida Loca" by Ricky Martin, "Mambo No. 5" by Lou 
Bega and REBOL all have in common? They all peaked for about a month 
in 1999 and nobody has thought they were cool ever since.
... man that's hard ...

A two-pronged attack killed REBOL. First, the fact that the end user 
had to single-handedly install an interpreter and do a good amount 
of legwork to get it and the application in sync ensured that the 
language wasn't going to be adopted by the masses" - the person clearly 
does not know, what he is ranting about ...

It is like Larry Wall (Perl) complaining, that REBOL has way too 
much of punctuation, for his liking :-)

lol

[] maybe are a ponctuation in his mind .... too much brackets ho 
common less than lisp anyway ... LISP ...  Lot of Insipid and Stupid 
Parenthesis :P

hum .... but at least this points the perception people outside of 
rebol community have about rebol...

and you know once people decided that rebol is another meaningless 
toy that's hard to show them the contrary ... That's why i always 
thought big language are made famous by big projects ...

j'ai deja du mal a me maintennir a flot sur paris si je dois bouger 
sur lyon je vais devoir dormir sous un pont ...

i find this article about rebol really unfair  ...

even if I'm agree that the rebol concept could or should be pushed 
further and that it was spread over too much OSes without taking 
full capabilities of the 3  or 4 main ones  ... that's not a reason 
to say it's  useless ...

man this guy is not cool in this article not only rebol is scratched 
and at the limit on the whole page the best comments are made on 
rebol lol... java2K .... lol ... poor java2K ...

poor intercal ...

rebol is not a ghost language no no no ....  well anyway i prefere 
my rebol ghost in my machine than .NET :P