World: r3wp

Please mock up an example -- you could do it in View layout  -- that'd 
make the discussion more concrete.

If I get some time I might do that.  One thing that confuses me is 
the top portion on the left it has the logon, control panel etc.. 
but at the bottom left it has a place to login.  Seems some of that 
might be redundant and might be better to also consolidate the options 
in one place on the left.

Thank would be good thanks.

Part of the problem is that though theoretical discussions are useful, 
a direct comparison ("is this better or worse than that?") is more 
likely to make better progress.

Yes, I was hoping a yound webdesigner (kid) was available to give 
some suggestions.  He is really outstanding at webdesign.  Hoping 
to get some input from him as I seen him transform some website will 
some good insight.

the links on the left are not categorize in a way that the mind can 
understand...


you have the 'sections' like Home, About, Contact Us etc... and later 
you have FAQ, New to Rebol etc 


my opinion is to get the high level categories defined first and 
that will be the main entry point a user will access various content

eg. the descriptive text of rebol 

--

It's a messaging language ` 'rebel' not 'ree-ball' ` code is data 
and data is code ` CGI? Yes ` 40+ platforms ` only 250K-500K ` console 
or GUI ` Yes, just a single file ` commercial versions = same core 
+ ODBC, SSL, and more - shallow learning curve, amazing depth ` keep 
IT simple ` if you liked "The Matrix"...
--


is lengthy and not focus... it also do not need to be at the top 
of every page...maybe it should go below 'About'

or 'New to Rebol'

and since I am babbling here... I will throw in some suggestions 
as well.


1. User are not interested in how many scripts there is in the library.

2. User are not interested in how many messages in the mailing list 
archive.

However, user may be interested in

1. Most popular script by download
2. Latest script contributed to the library
3

there is no '3'

Thanks for the comments.

Please do a mock-up of a proposed reorganization, thanks. Then we've 
got something to compare with.


Latest scripts are available several ways -- most immediate is the 
Script Library home page:
http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/script-index.r


Script popularity is available for Library members -- thoug the big 
problem here is deciding a meaningful metric (simple dowload counts 
are highly biased for various reasons)
http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/script-popularity.r

let me think through a bit... I will come back with something on 
the high-level categories

Thanks!

there is ALWAYS a 3...;-)     Picture or graphic of the most popular 
script with a quote.

If we had a sensible definition of the most popular script, we could 
do that.

by download and user rating?

user rating is an interesting concept......But that needs defining 
as a metric too. Who is rating for what? And who would bother?


Download is heavily biased by the fact that most downloads are by 
bots.

Older scripts are, by definition donwloaded more simply because they've 
been around longer

Also scripts near the start of the alphabet have an unfair advantage 
(they are near the top of any bots list)


Check out the "what does this all mean?" link on this page for a 
more detailed discussion:
http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/script-popularity.r

One thing I notice is that there are SEVERAL scripts that do pretty 
much the exact same thing - Text -> HTML, for example.


Perhaps they could be grouped together and people could rate which 
one of them they liked the best?

There's already an optional "see also" header, eg:

http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/view-script.r?script=ascii-chart.r

And there's no reason why that can't generate a footnote in the same 
way that the "replaced-by" header does, eg:

http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/view-script.r?script=calc-engine.r


All we need now is a volunteer to go through 600+ scripts and group 
them together.

Looks like someone once tried to automate such a task:

http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/ml-display-thread.r?m=rmlPWXB

The Library now has a search tool for the Mailing list archive.
     http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/ml-search.r
Please play, and let me know the problems, thanks.

Hm...  Seem to be missing the search field for Scripts/ML from the 
logon page...

That was deliberate -- multiple searches may be clutter up the page.

On the other hand, they may not --- I've put them back, so you can 
compare:
http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/index.r

I prefer having the search boxes there.  I would expect that most 
ppl that visit rebol.org have a good idea of what they are looking 
for and can generally get to it the quickest via a search.

I think that what really needs to happen to REBOL.org is simply a 
redesign on the Control Panel.  I'm still playing with some ideas 
on redoing the site's CSS but I haven't created anything that is 
much of an improvement over what is currently there...

That is good Sunanda. I think I prefer the search tools on the main 
page.

By the way, something that I never really liked is the short rebol 
description at the top of rebol.org. "'rebel' not 'ree-ball'" <- 
kind of rude, telling the interested party how to pronounce "rebol" 
before they've even tried it.  "if you liked 'The Matrix'" is kind 
of childish (notwithstanding the fact that I didn't think The Matrix 
was such a great movie).

So, here is a replacement proposal:

REBOL is an interpreted, internet messaging language. Highly flexible, 
REBOL 

saves time by reducing the amount of code you need to write. Code 
and data are 

the same. You can find and collapse repetitive patterns in data or 
code. Write 

your own dialects. Very easy to install, test and debug. Use the 
text editor you 
like.

I just noticed my last post was to the wrong group. :-(

Could add/replace some of that with "cross-platform, CGI, console 
and simple GUI dialect etc.."

What do you mean, Ammon ?

I mean although it may be on topic this isn't the channel that I 
intended to post that message too.

oh ok, no big deal..

on rebol description.


perhaps what can be done is to have a 20 words version (20wv) and 
a 50 words version (50wv) that can be used consistently.


20wv can be used as it is at the top of each page with the 50wv shown 
in 'About' or 'New to Rebol'.


The key idea is to allow developers to levarage on what is available 
and use it to help them 'sell' to others (IT mgnt etc)... apart from 
giving them the brief intro.

perhaps efishant can sponsor another competition .. to describe Rebol 
in under 20 and 50 words.  Winner gets a copy of  Visual Studio .Net 
BASIC.

( used once )

Thank guys

Ammon -- control panel  --- can you do a mockup to show what you 
are thinking?

Banner text -- this is a good place for that dicsussion.....REBOL.org 
could publish the winners and use one/some of them to replace the 
existing banner tex.

I've just oploaded my first 2 scripts to the library. rebxml2xml.r 
and xml2rebxml.r
I hope, I've done it correctly.

Looks good to me, thanks.

Though one oddity -- unlikely not your problem....They don't display 
in colour:

http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/view-script.r?color=yes&script=xml2rebxml.r

....Must be crashing Carl's color-code.r that we use to do the coloring, 
so we fall back to b&w. I'll take a closer look in a day ot two.

How about we have a no-cache directive to stop ISPs caching the scripts 
for the download page - so we are sure to get the latest one?

- the other way to do it, is to stick in a dummy cgi-bin in the path 
.. which also tells the cache not to cache it

Problem is that the download page *is* a static URL if you go to 
it directly, eg,
    http://www.rebol.org/library/scripts-download/menu-system.r

But of you click the "download script" link while viewing a script, 
you do go via a dynamic URL -- it creates the static one for you 
and then redirects, eg

http://www.rebol.org/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/rebol/download-a-script.r?script-name=menu-system.r


{What we should do is update the static file whenever a script is 
added or updated. That would fix most instances of this....I'll put 
that on the list, thanks]

Now that 1.3 is out, perhaps all of us who have scripts in the library 
should take the time to check them for compatibility, and update 
them if required.

Yes! Please do!

I would wait for some other platforms release. Just Win actually 
:-\

I'm chasing some old scripts from Frank Sievertsen, does anyone have 
the following

[lego.r  math-do.r irc-protocol.r reblog.r] all described here http://www.codeconscious.com/rebol/dialects.html

Also chasing svm.r Simple Virtual Machine which was related to the 
KOSH project

Allen: sent you email with Frank's scripts attached.

Brett: Thank you!

What else do you have Brett of Frank's ?