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[REBOL] Re: Documentation: Let's do it NOW!

From: petr:krenzelok:trz:cz at: 8-Aug-2003 12:30

Hi Robert and all, just abstract talk as always, - you know what you can expect of me already, don't you? ;-) Well, I will try to be on-topic. Some ppl wondered, why I am so inclined into having some features in sake of just having some features if I really don't need them. I think I can reasonably explain it. I come from business integration area and I try to look at most things in the way of how well they play together. And as you say, robert - scattered resources may destroy what could otherwise be very succesfull effort .... One concrete example is phoenix. I suggested them to swich to IOS. I know that the drawback is IOS is non-existant for AmigaOS/MorphOS, but even then happened what I expected. They formed Tiki (nothing agains wiki - I can value Graham's work in such regard!) and plenty of ml, IRC. But - the feeling of closer cooperation is still missing imo. It can't be imo easily achieved by mixing various existing technologies, which don't play well together. Well - what you propose is very good move imo. I wonder why the reblet is not more used! It looks really nice: (domain contains another various view related screenshots, just change the number) I think that RT did first step to such effort - View desktop. It just didn't take up. We should ask ourselves - why? And - are there any other examples of X-Internet efforts which are successfull? Imo yes - look at MacOSx Dr. Watson - .... excuse me - but isn't it EXACTLY the area View would excell at? Wrapping the web via X-Internet app center? Some other day I downloaded Java WebStart. It is just a bit enahnced ripp-off of View desktop GO button. You can see icons, which represent apps, which you can run. Typical app takes KBs, tens of KBs, or hundreds of KBs. Those Java weblets look simply rough, ugly. But - what is the difference? How did I get it onto my desktop? Well - plug-in! I was offered download. I just ask myself - if other can do it, why don't us? Deployment - that is the word! I can assure you, that no average joe user will go to, look for some Rebol View, trying to download it, install it, set-up it etc. It has to be offered to user, it has to download itself, place itself into some directory (or just ask for placement - AltME really simplifies its usage at least) and provide basic, simplified interface (we already know that some of us are really capable of producing cool looking reblets!). My idea was to call such product RebolWebPlayer or something like that. Imo idea of complete desktop (as View simulates) can scare some ppl - they already work in native OS desktop and are not interested in substitutes. What about something like single dialog, app-task-bar etc.? It would be much more acceptable. RebolWebPlayer would look for its updates (selectable) to ensure basic engine, protocols, are up-to-date. The idea was to eventually plug-in some P2P network scheme, use dialects for custom protocols. Each app would install itself into sand-box sub-directory, user could select, if, and how often to check for updates, etc. I have strong feeling something like that would be a success. Rebol DOC project is just one of such apps. But unless we don't have more powerfull engine under the hood (being it Uniserve, Maarten's new stuff he works upon), I would warn in some P2P principles from the very beginning - we will create yet another isoltated system, it just will be usabe directly from View. I would start to think how to enhance current Dictionary reblet (resizing for e.g.) and ask RT what they think of a player idea, as Carl mentions following in his recent interview: Of course, the final solution has to be put the X Internet into context within a consistent system of some sort or another, whether it be REBOL/IOS, SafeWorlds AltME, or some new type of web browser plugin. It's fun to think about. And, I think it will be fun to build. REBOL dictionary viewer however could be one of apps, which could leave on its own - it will be used mainly by developers, so at least I would put it into View as a component and offer it in standard 'help output and create 'vhelp mezzanine .... So yes, it could be usefull, - definitely ... I would just be carefull to overcomplicate it in the beginning .... -pekr- Robert M. Muench wrote: