[REBOL] Re: Documentation: Let's do it NOW!
From: petr:krenzelok:trz:cz at: 8-Aug-2003 12:30
Hi Robert and all,
just abstract talk as always, - you know what you can expect of me
already, don't you? ;-) Well, I will try to be on-topic.
Some ppl wondered, why I am so inclined into having some features in
sake of just having some features if I really don't need them. I think I
can reasonably explain it. I come from business integration area and I
try to look at most things in the way of how well they play together.
And as you say, robert - scattered resources may destroy what could
otherwise be very succesfull effort ....
One concrete example is phoenix. I suggested them to swich to IOS. I
know that the drawback is IOS is non-existant for AmigaOS/MorphOS, but
even then happened what I expected. They formed Tiki (nothing agains
wiki - I can value Graham's work in such regard!) and plenty of ml, IRC.
But - the feeling of closer cooperation is still missing imo. It can't
be imo easily achieved by mixing various existing technologies, which
don't play well together.
Well - what you propose is very good move imo. I wonder why the reblet
is not more used! It looks really nice:
http://www.rebol.cz/~can/rebol-view/image37.jpg (domain contains another
various view related screenshots, just change the number)
I think that RT did first step to such effort - View desktop. It just
didn't take up. We should ask ourselves - why? And - are there any other
examples of X-Internet efforts which are successfull? Imo yes - look at
MacOSx Dr. Watson - http://www.karelia.com/watson/ .... excuse me - but
isn't it EXACTLY the area View would excell at? Wrapping the web via
X-Internet app center?
Some other day I downloaded Java WebStart. It is just a bit enahnced
ripp-off of View desktop GO button. You can see icons, which represent
apps, which you can run. Typical app takes KBs, tens of KBs, or hundreds
of KBs. Those Java weblets look simply rough, ugly.
But - what is the difference? How did I get it onto my desktop? Well -
plug-in! I was offered download. I just ask myself - if other can do it,
why don't us? Deployment - that is the word! I can assure you, that no
average joe user will go to rebol.com, look for some Rebol View, trying
to download it, install it, set-up it etc. It has to be offered to user,
it has to download itself, place itself into some directory (or just ask
for placement - AltME really simplifies its usage at least) and provide
basic, simplified interface (we already know that some of us are really
capable of producing cool looking reblets!). My idea was to call such
product RebolWebPlayer or something like that. Imo idea of complete
desktop (as View simulates) can scare some ppl - they already work in
native OS desktop and are not interested in substitutes. What about
something like single dialog, app-task-bar etc.? It would be much more
acceptable. RebolWebPlayer would look for its updates (selectable) to
ensure basic engine, protocols, are up-to-date. The idea was to
eventually plug-in some P2P network scheme, use dialects for custom
protocols. Each app would install itself into sand-box sub-directory,
user could select, if, and how often to check for updates, etc.
I have strong feeling something like that would be a success. Rebol DOC
project is just one of such apps. But unless we don't have more
powerfull engine under the hood (being it Uniserve, Maarten's new stuff
he works upon), I would warn in some P2P principles from the very
beginning - we will create yet another isoltated system, it just will be
usabe directly from View. I would start to think how to enhance current
Dictionary reblet (resizing for e.g.) and ask RT what they think of a
player idea, as Carl mentions following in his recent amiga.org interview:
Of course, the final solution has to be put the X Internet into
context within a consistent system of some sort or another, whether it
be REBOL/IOS, SafeWorlds AltME, or some new type of web browser
plugin. It's fun to think about. And, I think it will be fun to build.
REBOL dictionary viewer however could be one of apps, which could leave
on its own - it will be used mainly by developers, so at least I would
put it into View as a component and offer it in standard 'help output
and create 'vhelp mezzanine .... So yes, it could be usefull, -
definitely ... I would just be carefull to overcomplicate it in the
beginning ....
-pekr-
Robert M. Muench wrote:
