r3wp [groups: 83 posts: 189283]
  • Home
  • Script library
  • AltME Archive
  • Mailing list
  • Articles Index
  • Site search
 

World: r3wp

[!Cheyenne] Discussions about the Cheyenne Web Server

btiffin
31-Aug-2007
[2138]
I don't think I would have pursued setting up peoplecards.ca without 
a REBOL web server behind it, and now to patiently wait for (or get 
motivated to write) a nice REBOL forum.  :)
amacleod
31-Aug-2007
[2139x2]
As much as I like the idea of Cheyenne i thing the Rebol plugin is 
the future. The adobe and Microsoft solutions seem to bypass HTML. 
 If R3 can offer aht I think it promises why creat an html base site 
if you can make a rebol app and "plug it in"  to the site.
aht = what
btiffin
31-Aug-2007
[2141]
This conversation has made me decide to pursue getting vanilla running 
under .9.16  So close to Cheyenne 1.0rc1 though.   I think it'll 
be time well wasted.  


Alan...still need something delivering off of port 80 though no? 
 Maybe not HTML in the future but Cheyenne is an awesome http delivery 
system.  imho.
amacleod
31-Aug-2007
[2142]
Agreed...Cheyenne is simple to deploy and setup and great if you 
plan to use rebol for RSP...You will always need an HTML server to 
deliver content but the form of the content?  Is Cheyenne, knowing 
that its Rebol based and supports RSP, does it offer something that 
is ground breaking..or unusual...not seen before.
btiffin
31-Aug-2007
[2143]
It may be too late, but I've always wondered why there isn't a REBOL 
browser in the offing.  In the beginning, a whole decade ago, which 
is 70 internet years, the Hot Java browser got more press than Oak 
ever did.
amacleod
31-Aug-2007
[2144]
Oak?
btiffin
31-Aug-2007
[2145]
Java.  Before Gosling was sitting in a cafe worried about naming 
conflicts.
amacleod
31-Aug-2007
[2146x2]
With R# I would like to some way to atleast display a web page in 
a window/face..
R# = R3
btiffin
31-Aug-2007
[2148]
Yep.  It would close the gaping hole in the whole.  :)
Graham
1-Sep-2007
[2149x3]
The problem with Vanilla is that it does not appear to be updated 
anymore by the authors
To be pragamatic, one has to look for something that is being updated.
I'm running ubuntu 7 with vmware server - and then running my apps 
as appliances.
btiffin
1-Sep-2007
[2152x3]
I'm finding that (like most non-trivial REBOL web apps) vanilla is 
using globals that conflict with Cheyenne.  session in the first 
case I've tracked down.  It won't be that hard to fix, but name collisions 
are a pain in the...
Graham;  I was a polyFORTH programmer.  'being updated?'  Why that's 
for young whippersnappers.  :)  Old and stale is way better.
Moving to Linux.
Chris
5-Sep-2007
[2155x2]
Seems to me that is a problem with Cheyenne CGI.  You mentioned that 
QM has some globals conflict?  Though I understand CGI inclusion 
is for convenience, some compatibility -- not as the recommended 
development path.
'that is a problem' == 'Vanilla is using globals that conflict with 
Cheyenne'
btiffin
5-Sep-2007
[2157]
Yeah, QM conflicts with  request  and Vanilla conflicts with  session 
 (at the quick glance I've taken so far).  These types of problems 
are pretty easy to fix given the motivation.  REBOL is eminently 
readable; all it requires is a little motivation, time and judicious 
use of context or global find and replace.  Collisions are always 
hit or miss, but the web related scripts usually collide just by 
nature of the higher level words being the perfect words for the 
concept at hand.   People running Apache would never see these collisions.


R3 holds a lot of promise in allowing us rebols the freedom for independent 
development that others can combine in fun and magical ways, worry 
free of this issue.  Another year and this type of complaint should 
be a thing of distant memory.
Chris
6-Sep-2007
[2158]
Yes, that is my hope.  I've been pining for the namespaces for some 
time (instead of building up a succession of leaky objects).
Graham
10-Sep-2007
[2159x3]
I wonder if it makes sense to associate globals with a webapp.
I want to run multiple versions of my portal ... connecting to different 
odbc connections.
This means I have to change the database name in all the rsp pages 
of my app, whereas if the name were confined to the web app, I would 
not need to do so.
Chris
10-Sep-2007
[2162x2]
It'd be fine if all RSP scripts ran in their own namespace...
Or all the RSP scripts of a single instance.
Dockimbel
3-Oct-2007
[2164]
I'm not sure to understand the issue with Cheyenne CGI ? For RSP, 
there's a list of global words that MUST not be modified like : request, 
session, response... If you want to use, in RSP code, a framework 
that will conflict with RSP words in global space, you'd better wait 
for R3 to cleanly handle those issues, R2 namespace managment is 
just too limited.
Oldes
3-Oct-2007
[2165]
Cannot you just use PROTECT to protect these words?
>> x: 1
== 1
>> x: 1 protect 'x
>> x
== 1
>> x: 2
** Script Error: Word x is protected, cannot modify
** Near: x: 2
>>
Dockimbel
3-Oct-2007
[2166x3]
The global words used by RSP are already PROTECTed. From %RSP.r :
protect [
	do-sql db-cache request response session include
	include-file validate locale say
]
Protecting globals words doesn't solve word conflicting issues between 
frameworks, it just raises cleaner errors.
amacleod
11-Oct-2007
[2169]
Has Doc released version 1 yet. I saw in his blog that he hoped to 
relese by Augustt.Perhaps I missed it...
Will
11-Oct-2007
[2170x2]
not yet but he is working on a new release, probably a good time 
to send in bugs (if any!) and feature requests http://softinnov.org:8000/curecode/
btw, I stoppend months ago monitoring production Cheyenne servers 
as they just work flowlessly and at great speed ! Dock rules ! 8)
amacleod
11-Oct-2007
[2172]
I've been using it also without any real problems. I as hoping to 
get my hands on his admin panel and some more docs on rsp
Graham
11-Oct-2007
[2173]
the admin panel is what's holding up release 1 isn't it ?
Robert
12-Oct-2007
[2174]
What's the best way to do dynamic pages with Cheyenne and Rebol? 
Does it has RSP or something like this build in?
Pekr
12-Oct-2007
[2175]
yes, RSP module is supported, and maybe even documented? I don't 
remember correctly. Sadly I can't use Cheyenne yet, as I developed 
another aproach, and the thing is, that I override Apache handler 
for .html files to rsp.cgi, so all my html goes thru this dispatcher. 
Cheyenne can't handle such aproach yet ...
Robert
12-Oct-2007
[2176]
IIRC there was/is something called Magic as well. How is Magic related 
to RSP?
Pekr
12-Oct-2007
[2177]
Magic is separate templating system. Don't remember it much, maybe 
that I just did not like it ... can't accept any system, mixing programming 
code and html.
amacleod
12-Oct-2007
[2178x3]
Magic has a more complete framework
You can program wigets into the web page
I've been using rsp for a few small projects but I do not know its 
full capabiltiy. Yesterday I wrote a counter in two lines of code.
Will
12-Oct-2007
[2181x2]
RSP is the best way and the faster inexecution/response time (instead 
of Apache cgi, it doesn't need to load rebol and your init library 
at each request), to do dynamic stuff with Cheyenne. The API is very 
sleek and you can read about it in the downloadable documentation 
part of Cheyeene download.
If you haven't, you should at least give it a try, you wont regreat 
! assured! 8-)
Terry
12-Oct-2007
[2183]
I have an Atom semantic network db  framewerk that's nearly ready 
for incorporation into Cheyenne.. check out the !Atom group for more 
details.
btiffin
12-Oct-2007
[2184]
Perhaps this is more a chat related issue.  How would you feel if 
you went to a site  index.html  (explicitly .html)  and later found 
out it was actually an rsp  file with an .html filename.   Is that 
dirty-pool in web land?  I'm asking as Cheyenne .rsp makes it so 
easy to keep track of page hits and there are no <script> tags required 
and no redirects etc etc. I haven't turned it on in production peoplecards.ca 
as I think it's dirty-pool.  Looking for other's opinions.
Graham
14-Oct-2007
[2185]
I encapped cheyenne and it appeared to run okay, but I got all sorts 
of odbc errors :(
Terry
14-Oct-2007
[2186]
You need Atom ;)
Terry
19-Oct-2007
[2187]
Hey Doc.. how does Embed work with the latest release?