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World: r3wp

[!REBOL3-OLD1]

Henrik
11-Jun-2009
[15300x2]
Next time the GUI will be touched, will be a redesign of the layout 
engine, which performs poorly right now.
Then style development will continue, hopefully sometime in July 
or August depending on the GUI situation.
Maxim
11-Jun-2009
[15302]
might want to get me in the loop when that happens (layout work)... 
by then I should be delving into R3, so I'd be able to contribute 
experience... not just theory ;-) ... 

I've been designing and evaluating many (I mean dozens) of auto layout 
engines thru the years...
Henrik
11-Jun-2009
[15303]
The layout engine specs are already in place, just need them to be 
implemented.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15304]
a general question for those of you actively testing using REBOL3. 
 Is it stable, a part from the known bugs or function differences.... 


Once a rebol3 source works... can it be expected to run for a long 
time or are there still many internal bugs which will inevitably 
cause the app to crash (gc instability for example).
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15305]
I don't think there are many known GC bugs. The largest scripts run 
yet are those of VID3.4 (around 50-100 kb) and they are fairly stable. 
No leaks have been found yet, but we aren't yet looking very hard 
for those.
Oldes
12-Jun-2009
[15306]
Isn't R3 chat server running on R3?
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15307]
yeah... but its close to god so does that count ?  ;-)
BrianH
12-Jun-2009
[15308]
The problem is that most of the code written in R3 has been written 
by people who have a good idea of the internals, who know what is 
optimal and what is not. This means that the code tends to more heavily 
represent good code techniques and practices - thus, those code patterns 
are more thoroughly tested and stable. What hasn't been as tested 
as much is bad or erroneous code: Some of that can still crash R3 
at this point.


Fortunately, new users have been joining the fray, and many of them 
are not aware of the internals or best practices. Or in Ladislav's 
case, exhaustively thorough in their testing coverage. Because of 
this R3 is much more stable than it was a month ago :)
Sunanda
12-Jun-2009
[15309]
If you search curecode.org for [gc] or [garbage collection[ there 
are very few bug reports.

Maybe it is time for someone to step up and try some serious stress 
tests.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15310]
hehehe  I think I`m going to give A56 a real run for its money  :-)
Sunanda
12-Jun-2009
[15311]
Go for it, Maxim!
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15312x2]
I'm going to try to port liquid to R3 tonight.... just for fun.
I'll be using modules if possible.   an earlier version of R3 just 
crashed when trying to allocate a single node... we'll see.

is there a page which explains various optimisations one can do to 
R2 code to allow it to take advantage of newer and faster functions 
in R3?
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15314]
Maxim, try to look through the cookbooks section in the wiki at http://rebol.net/wiki/Cookbooks

There are a few things. Not much yet.
Sunanda
12-Jun-2009
[15315]
I tried porting one small script (not even an application) earlier 
today.
Good news -- it worked in most cases.

Bad news -- some of the sanity validations failed because the nature 
of strings have changed.


Lots of R3 is native where R2 was mezz......That often speeds things 
up.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15316]
I also need to get myself an account for the R3 chat.
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15317]
Maxim, so many things to do. Can your super brain handle it? :-)
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15318x3]
I've just finished helping the plumber install a new submersible 
pump in my 50 meter deep well, changed all the electricals too... 
I didn't have water for the last 4 days... 


now I can give myself a rare treat.  taking the rest of the day off 
today, so I can do my things.... and that includes one "fun" project... 
usually a short project that I've been putting off of a long time... 
today its liquid/R3  :-)
my brain isn't the problem... I only have two hands... sometimes 
I'd like to be dr octopus  ;-)
WOW   Rebol 3 is   #1  that's THE VERY FIRST LINK if you search for 

R3 alpha
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15321]
It would be cool if it was the first that was returned if typing 
in "r3". :-)
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15322x3]
well SAP is going to be a big one to topple for that bragging right 
 ;-)
I think Carl should post that in his next Carl blog  :-)   being 
first with something as generic as R3 Alpha is no small feat....
I'll poke him with that when I get to enabling my R3 chat later on.
BrianH
12-Jun-2009
[15325]
Sunanda, your "memory exhaustion" ticket (bug#920) was not a GC bug, 
in fact not a bug at all. Look at the comment for details :)
Sunanda
12-Jun-2009
[15326x2]
You are quick with the bug analysis!


Not entirely sure why you consider it not a bug. Recast this way, 
it looks a horrible problem....
   for n 1 10 1 [print n a: mold system]
....It gets slower and slower and then dies.
...And the I may need a new session as:
  b: mold system
now does not have enough memory.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15328x4]
devbase is a strange space.  its like: "altme in the twilight zone" 
 even the white letters on black of the dos shell  bg re-inforce 
this  ;-)
I've noticed that devbase has the same problem as altme at recognising 
the daylight saving time... I have a one hour offset in time postings.
is that a known issue?
also the "g" command of devbase doesn't seem to work when #xxxx is 
in messages, but it works for curecode and html.
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15332x2]
yes, it's a very known issue
I suppose 'g for message numbers could be added.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15334x4]
hehe... you posted just after I reported it directly on devbase... 
like seconds appart  :-)
I actually like devbase.  the direct number navigation is quite possible. 
 I can just type 14   and go to R3 section directly wherever I am... 
that is very cool.
possible = powerfull...
are any plugin docs available yet?
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15338x2]
no, not yet
try

f "chat.r"

to get the post where you can get the source for chat.r
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15340x2]
cool.
what rank must I be to create headings?
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15342]
there is a list in devbase help in the wiki
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15343]
aaah ok... will look it up
Henrik
12-Jun-2009
[15344]
If you feel like adding a feature, go ahead, and post it to curecode. 
Carl probably prefers 1-2 line fixes, though.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15345x2]
ok.
could someone either raise my rank so I can add a lib within Community/Libraries 
or add a heading called liquid there.  I'd post my R3 related comments 
for liquid there... I think Carl would like some feedback on my efforts/problems 
porting such an advanced tool into R3.  when it will work, I'll also 
be posting comparative benchmarks.
BrianH
12-Jun-2009
[15347x2]
Sunanda, the reason it's not a bug is because for every iteration, 
'a is set to mold system, and mold system includes the previous value 
of 'a from the previous iteration, as a string. So that means that 
every iteration is the length of the rest of the system, plus the 
length of the previous 'a times the number of visible references 
to it. Since there are 4 visible references to the collection of 
global words, this means that the growth is exponential, and of a 
larger exponent than R2 (which has only one visible reference to 
the global words, so it just doubles).


The way to prevent the exponential growth is to assign none to 'a, 
or unset 'a, before you mold the system again.
The 4 visible references to the global words should be cut down to 
1 or 2 once the rest of the module system is done. The other 2 will 
refer to separate contexts than the current "global" context.
Maxim
12-Jun-2009
[15349]
I've officially just created a new file on my system.... its called: 
   liquid.r3  
let the fun begin  ;-)